Gwagon MG

[Guest]

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever

Login with username, password and session length

[Tymathee]

With the MG the Gwagon still doesn't fulfill dual roles. Its pathing is shit and its turn speed is slower than snails fucking. It's by no means an assault unit. The MG is a deterrent against infantry rushes but it isn't a win button.

I'm glad to hear the unit will be looked at price/pop-wise because it sorely needs one or both of those fixed.

6 pop means it's spammable... Where do you get your crazy assertions Tym? Is there a hidden "Allied player talking points" forum somewhere? Do me and 8thRifle need to start an "Axis player talking points" email list to compensate?

Malgoroth, like I said, I played a game against G-wagon spam and it was only 8 pop, if they were 6, you'd see a lot of dual g-wagon, tri g-wagon, even 4 g-wagon games. Yes it's slow but if you have 3 or 4 of them coming down on you, it doesn't matter if the radius is slow.

and also like I stated, if it didn't have the hmg, i'd wholly agree, much like I said if the m-18 didn't have the 50 cal and hawk upgrades i'd be cool with it being 8 pop since it penetrates tanks so poorly but because it's not a singular pupose unit that doesn't do that single purpose well but has upgrades that do others, then no, you don't change the pop. Price, yes, pop no.

[PonySlaystation]

That is a really good fucking question. lol

We've been discussing this one internally. The vCoH beta is reworking the unit, so after we get a full picture of what they are doing with it, we might implement the mainstream fix instead of just tampering with the gun stats more. Then we can talk about price and pop fixes.

I second this, if relic actually does a good job, then EIR should follow.

[Demon767]

Your theory is off Tym

Your saying we are literally paying mu and 2 pop for a MG on a tank platform. Thats ludicrous!

Its the exact younger brother of a Marder, but luckily enough you can pay for a MG, this doesnt constitute for a 2 pop increase no matter how hard you try to argue the point.

And your example does not prove your point, ill give you the reason why.

Bad games?
Bad players?
L2P?

There is to many variables based of your example.

[RikiRude]

Your theory is off Tym

Your saying we are literally paying mu and 2 pop for a MG on a tank platform. Thats ludicrous!

Its the exact younger brother of a Marder, but luckily enough you can pay for a MG, this doesnt constitute for a 2 pop increase no matter how hard you try to argue the point.

And your example does not prove your point, ill give you the reason why.

Bad games?
Bad players?
L2P?

There is to many variables based of your example.

according to tym, gwagon should be 6 pop and the mg should cost 2 pop =P

[AmPM]

According to Tym LMG42's are awesome suppression tools that can kill anything....

[Tymathee]

Show me a vehicle with a weapon or upgrade as strong as the HMG on teh G-wagon that's lower than 8 pop, be it light vehicle or tank and i'll shut up.

[AmPM]

Quad.

[Tymathee]

but it sux vs tanks, it's singular purpose. it can kill light vehicles but u dont use it for that unless to finish it off & lower health and armor, that doesn't count.

oh and if the g-wagon should be 6 pop, why dont you go ahead and make the stug 6 pop? lower damage than the g-wagon, same gun upgrade, similar health.

[LeoPhone]

or just the US HT, WM HT, PE INF HT.
bren MMG carrier.

all dual purpose. inf carrying/button and killing/supressing inf.

[Tymathee]

well, i meant a vehicle that has a main gun and an hmg as its secondary weapon, not just any vehicle.

i.e. Staghound, m8, p4, sherman, jumbo, panther etc.

I should've made that more clear, apologies.

[AmPM]

but it sux vs tanks, it's singular purpose. it can kill light vehicles but u dont use it for that unless to finish it off & lower health and armor, that doesn't count.

oh and if the g-wagon should be 6 pop, why dont you go ahead and make the stug 6 pop? lower damage than the g-wagon, same gun upgrade, similar health.

Better Armor, same damage, less range, better maingun vs infantry, STuG powerslide, medium crush.

[EliteGren]

Well you can load schrecks into an infantry halftrack to achieve the same effect

[Tymathee]

Better Armor, same damage, less range, better maingun vs infantry, STuG powerslide, medium crush.

how is it same damage? Stug does 87.5 just like all medium tanks and since the g-wagon has the marder cannon, that means it's 150 dmg, nice math there.

oh and cuz u can powerslide lol but still it's in the same glass, its a slow turning tank destroyer with a strong top hmg. but it's still kinda useless, dont see many stugs

heck, the g-wagon has more speed AND acceleration than the stug. and decel, (speed 6, accel 4, decel 6)

oh and g-wagon has medium crush.

[panzerman]

i see so many stugs, and stug spam. but i hardly see G-wagon, and when i used it i never put the hmg on top cause it wasn't worth the muni's

[puddin]

how is it same damage? Stug does 87.5 just like all medium tanks and since the g-wagon has the marder cannon, that means it's 150 dmg, nice math there.

oh and cuz u can powerslide lol but still it's in the same glass, its a slow turning tank destroyer with a strong top hmg. but it's still kinda useless, dont see many stugs

heck, the g-wagon has more speed AND acceleration than the stug. and decel, (speed 6, accel 4, decel 6)


Skirts are the difference....

A stug can take zook shots to the front and at guns non ap rounds... A gwagon is like light armor when that haoppens and deflects nothing...
oh and g-wagon has medium crush.

[Malgoroth]

Did Tym just say he doesn't see many stugs? And he's complaining the Gwagons are getting spammed?
Doesn't see many stugs.... really? But Gwagons are problematic??

Alright. Obviously Tym's reality is on a separate (and totally backwards) plane of existence than the the rest of us.


Anyhow. It is indefensible to argue that an OPTIONAL mg upgrade constitutes a 2 pop increase over the units' twin in another faction. What if you don't WANT the MG upgrade? What if all you buy is the repair and the rapid fire rounds, in which case the thing is nearly identical to a marder. Why then, if it has no MG, is it still 8 pop?

Easy fix: Make it two separate units. One without the MG, one with, priced and "popped" accordingly. The one without the MG would have the option to buy rapid fire rounds, the other would just have the MG standard without the rapid fire rounds option.

Does that make everyone happy? It'd work for me. If Tym has a problem with this... then he loses the right to say he isn't a fan boy.  

[Hicks58]

I'd suggest either knock the Geshitz down to 6 pop and leave it as it is performance wise, or make it perform better somehow and leave it at it's current pop.

If people want to spam the Geshitz, they can chew on handheld AT or Pershings. Both will tear them to ribbons applied properly and with support.

Panda attempted spamming the Geshitz against me and it resulted in a Pershing killing 5 of the buggers single handedly.

Mind you though, if I had it my way, ALL vehicles with the exception of jeeps or bikes would crush light and heavy cover. That would likely solve a good portion of pathing issues.

[AmPM]

how is it same damage? Stug does 87.5 just like all medium tanks and since the g-wagon has the marder cannon, that means it's 150 dmg, nice math there.

oh and cuz u can powerslide lol but still it's in the same glass, its a slow turning tank destroyer with a strong top hmg. but it's still kinda useless, dont see many stugs

heck, the g-wagon has more speed AND acceleration than the stug. and decel, (speed 6, accel 4, decel 6)

oh and g-wagon has medium crush.

STuG has 87.5 base damage, and a 150% modifier vs M10, Sherman, etc.

It also has much better AI ability than the Gwagon. Skirts are helpful, but its still tough from the front without them.

[Tymathee]

131 dmg =/= 150 dmg

nor does

109.375 = 131

(m10 = 1.25 dmg)

[Malgoroth]

It's a lot closer to 150 than 87.5. Closest w/o going over wins.