Increase pen on p4

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[Jodomar]

I've been using p4's recently and it seems that they really need more penetration. They seem to bounce a hell of a lot. For instance I shot a fire fly four times in a row and they all bounced. I noticed my team mates have the same issue. I do think this is rather dumb and would make the p4 very useful again if only it's penetration was higher. Thoughts on this?

[PonySlaystation]

The PzIV is not a Tank Destroyer like the Stug or the Panther. It does however still perform well against most tanks so I don't think a change is necessary. One account of bad luck does not make it a bad unit.

The PzIV was long useless because of the high MUNI costs and it was usually better to get an Ostwind.
But now that the costs for the PzIV are changed you basically get a tank that works well against both infantry and tanks for the same price. You might argue that the Panther benefited more from this change, but that is another issue.

[Hicks58]

62% Base penetration chance is more than enough tbh.

Sounds to me like your a victim of bad dice rolls. I've had some rage moments where a Pershing bounces off a PIV then the PIV goes and penetrates the Pershing.

So no, increasing the penetration of the PIV isn't the way to go.

[NightRain]

P4 is supposed to be a general unit with all purposes yet it appears to lack in every of them. While slightly more expensive than M10 it still takes it to his face from M10 and M18 hellcats and from the shermans.

In short it is a small Tiger with higher RoF Than a sherman. If I wanted a Ai tank I'd go with Ostwind, if I wanted something that can do both I'd choose StuG. I leave P4s to the shop.

But what Hicks said, bad dicerolls. I also hesitate when I see 100 mun price in it. And 275 fuel with skirts...

[AmPM]

P4 is supposed to be a general unit with all purposes yet it appears to lack in every of them. While slightly more expensive than M10 it still takes it to his face from M10 and M18 hellcats and from the shermans.

In short it is a small Tiger with higher RoF Than a sherman. If I wanted a Ai tank I'd go with Ostwind, if I wanted something that can do both I'd choose StuG. I leave P4s to the shop.

But what Hicks said, bad dicerolls. I also hesitate when I see 100 mun price in it. And 275 fuel with skirts...

Why is the P4 more expensive than the Sherman anyway?

[tank130]

it to his face from M10 and M18 hellcats and from the shermans.

ummmmm, I would be pretty pissed if I purchased a TANK DESTROYER (aka M10 / M18) and it didn't kick the shit out of a P4......

I think the only time a Sherman gives it to a P4 in the face would be if it is upgunned.

[chefarzt]

If u want to kill inf and lvs take the ostwind. For tanks use stugs and panthers. If u got too much munitions P4 is the way to go....

[PonySlaystation]

Why is the P4 more expensive than the Sherman anyway?

TBH the Sherman is more expensive. The PzIV costs 5 manpower and 10 fuel more, which is less than noticeable. The big difference is that the Sherman gunner costs 20 munitions more.

Also to all of you who would rather choose the Ostwind you should consider that the PzIV, with the gunner can deal pretty much the same amount of damage but also has better armor and can engage tanks.

[chefarzt]

Well 50 cal is simply better. Except if u choose the that stug mg t3 from terror.

[DarkSoldierX]

Penetration on the P4 is actually quite good compared to crom and the sherman 75. Also doesn't have to deal with heavily armored vehicles nearly as much and has a higher ROF.

[AmPM]

ummmmm, I would be pretty pissed if I purchased a TANK DESTROYER (aka M10 / M18) and it didn't kick the shit out of a P4......

I think the only time a Sherman gives it to a P4 in the face would be if it is upgunned.

That would almost be like buying a STuG and having it face raped by an upgun Sherman, M8, T17, or TD right?

If anything, STuG pen should go up, but I would be happy with a rework of HEAT rounds to be a larger pen bonus and smaller damage bonus for STuGs and Mediums.

[smurfORnot]

if you are allied player,and you buy m10,you can kill tanks and inf better with it than with p4,only thing p4 has edge is it can soak probably 1 hit more than m10.

[Spartan_Marine88]

If anything, STuG pen should go up, but I would be happy with a rework of HEAT rounds to be a larger pen bonus and smaller damage bonus for STuGs and Mediums.

I think P4 is fine personally, only time i ever get it raped is when i over extend a bit to much and get out of my atg's back up range.


Stug on the other hand i completely agree with getting a pen upgrade, make it the TD its supposed to be.

[aeroblade56]

I have seen p4s do some serous damage either from Shabtajus and Dnicee raking up 15+ kills each. The p4 i find 1v1 sherman without upgun is pretty nasty and a P4 will always take down a Cromwell unless it has flank speed. even with the bonus penetration on the Cromwell i have found it not effective vs the p4. of course the p4 feels like it penetrates the Cromwell like a needle through honey.

[Spartan_Marine88]

of course the p4 feels like it penetrates the Cromwell like a needle through honey.

everything penetrates the cromwell

[nikomas]

Stug on the other hand i completely agree with getting a pen upgrade, make it the TD its supposed to be.

While I'm all for upping the pen on the stug (8/9 StuG/StuH Dual Repair Panzer Ace Blitzcoy ahoye!) it's really not a Tank Destroyer, It's an assault gun...
That's really just a cheap, turretless tank, if anything it should proboably get more HE damage 

(That wouldnt break annyyyything at all)

[Poppi]

increase pen so they can reduce splash?

[NightRain]

StuG's fine. It gets damage modifiers vs M10 and Sherman. All it needs is a check if it gets those modifiers vs Cromwells. It also needs one vs Pershing if possible.

[Spartan_Marine88]

While I'm all for upping the pen on the stug (8/9 StuG/StuH Dual Repair Panzer Ace Blitzcoy ahoye!) it's really not a Tank Destroyer, It's an assault gun...

It was an assault gun whos primary role was as a TD, well maybe not primary but got used ALOT in that role

[AmPM]

It was an assault gun whos primary role was as a TD, well maybe not primary but got used ALOT in that role

True, the most produced German TD of the war =)