Ukraine and the Crimea

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[TheIcelandicManiac]

Yea im just gonna do everyone a favor and lock this, if the mods want to keep this going just unlock it or something but talking about how the nazis were good isnt something worth talking about.

[Hicks58]

Unlocked.

Simple reason being that whilst Pony's views are questionable (Politely put), they are for the moment nothing more than views and perspectives.

Extremely strong or extremely different views/opinions/perspectives will always get reactions from people.

Full-on moderation being Tank's department, it should be down to him or the SDT what ultimately becomes of this thread - I've had to resist locking a number of threads in the past.

Unless SDT poke in and say otherwise, carry on.

PS: I can understand and appreciate why you'd do that though Icelandic so don't take this as an offence, but simply a technicality.

[nikomas]

So... Ukraine... Fucked up eh? Guys? 

[XIIcorps]

Unlocked.

Simple reason being that whilst Pony's views are questionable (Politely put), they are for the moment nothing more than views and perspectives.

Extremely strong or extremely different views/opinions/perspectives will always get reactions from people.

Full-on moderation being Tank's department, it should be down to him or the SDT what ultimately becomes of this thread - I've had to resist locking a number of threads in the past.

Unless SDT poke in and say otherwise, carry on.

PS: I can understand and appreciate why you'd do that though Icelandic so don't take this as an offence, but simply a technicality.

Ice created this, Ice locked this.

How do you guys have the powers to reverse this ?
its not like he posted something inappropriate only to immediately lock it after having the last word.

This is just perpetuating the madness that this thread has descended into, its way off topic and its border lining on people being banned.

[GrayWolf]

So... Ukraine... Fucked up eh? Guys? 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/max-kolonko/crisis-in-ukraine-what-to-know_b_4913223.html

[Unkn0wn]

Putin doesn't want to re-instigate the Soviet Union per se, but he does want to create a counterweight 'bloc' to the EU and US. The plans for that are already on the table, with the creation of the Euroasion Economic Union in 2015. Right now though, only Kazakhstan and Belarus are officially signed up to it and Putin has always made clear that he sees Ukraine's membership as vital. Ukraine, even when it looks to the West needs Russia, and Putin knows that. The de facto annexation of Crimea which we see happening now was a perfect opportunity for Russia to assert its power and 'attraction' in the region and Russia could use this as bargaining power in upcoming negotiations with a pro-EU Ukranian government. Crimea itself has very little to offer in terms of economy, as such it makes no sense for Russia to try and hold on to it at any cost. As long as they are able to maintain their military presence there they will be relatively content.

[Sachaztan]

I don't see how Putin can back down now. Russia has painted itself into a corner with it's propaganda. Since the Russians are "right" and the ethnic Russians in Crimea is threatened with "ethnic cleansing", backing down to EU/US threats will be considered weak by the Russians and weaken Putin's powerbase. Likewise it will be considered a betrayal for the Russian people if Russia doesn't annex Crimea after the Crimean election. So there's really only one course left open to Putin, likely he will gamble that EU/US won't make good on their threats because of how much it will cost them.

So the question is what will EU/US/Ukraine do? Meaningless token sanctions just to say they did something? All out economic war that will put the world in a global recession? Will Ukraine perhaps do what all countries should do, and defend their borders even if it will spell doom for them?

[Bear]

History suggests Ukraine has lost Crimea forever
http://www.thenewstribune.com/2014/03/03/3076827/history-suggests-ukraine-has-lost.html

Jake Tapper to White House Official: ‘It Appears That Crimea Is Lost’
http://www.mediaite.com/tv/jake-tapper-to-white-house-official-it-appears-that-crimea-is-lost/

[TheIcelandicManiac]

PS: I can understand and appreciate why you'd do that though Icelandic so don't take this as an offence, but simply a technicality.

its less that i dont i want to hear about what hitler did good for germany but the storys my grandma told me how she lost relatives and friends in the war by the hands of the german both trough the occupation of Norway, Denmark and the camps in Germany i have no interest in reading about that crap in a thread i started.

[skaffa]

Crimea river?

lololjkheya

[Tymathee]

honestly, i dont care what the US did in WWII but killing a race of people and "undesirables" is just being a huge asshole and saying anything about them is "good" is just crazy.

As to the Crimea thing. Anybody read Command Authority by Tom Clancy? It's about the Crimea peninsula and it's crazy how close it really is to what's really going on. Not the first time Tom Clancy was a prophet.

My personal feelings on the situation, I could give a crap about what Russia does concerning the Ukraine but i do feel we should stay out of it and let the UN handle it diplomatically, if they want to sanction them, fine but i'm so sick of our republicans at home whining about Obama's lack of balls. OH you mean it's not okay to not want to kill other human beings and spew rhetoric at another sovereign country like they're a big child? Fucking idiots, i really hate the republican party.

[aeroblade56]

Scumbag USA. has terrible economy  and is branded world police, goes and fights russia economy is still in shitland.

[I2ay]

honestly, i dont care what the US did in WWII but killing a race of people and "undesirables" is just being a huge asshole and saying anything about them is "good" is just crazy.

Oh really? It's fucking crazy to say that saving an entire country of people from being destitute and practically starving to death because the entire civilized world is making an effort to punish them for something that's not their fault isn't good? Hitler did a ton of bad shit but he also pulled one of the worst off countries following world war 1 out of an economical slump and made them a force to be reckoned with. The standard of living in Germany sky rocketed following his policies and regardless if they would have worked long term without war its almost a miracle he could pull something that life changing off in such a short period of time. I don't know if you had to see the pictures of people in Germany using the german mark as wallpaper because it was so fucking worthless or the pictures of people bringing wheel barrows full of money to pay for a simple piece of bread but it was fucking disgusting. You can say Hitler was a bad guy and you wouldn't be wrong at all, but if anything he was at least partially a product of shit storm that the world decided to bring upon central Europe for their part in World War 1.

[GrayWolf]

Oh really? It's fucking crazy to say that saving an entire country of people from being destitute and practically starving to death because the entire civilized world is making an effort to punish them for something that's not their fault isn't good? Hitler did a ton of bad shit but he also pulled one of the worst off countries following world war 1 out of an economical slump and made them a force to be reckoned with. The standard of living in Germany sky rocketed following his policies and regardless if they would have worked long term without war its almost a miracle he could pull something that life changing off in such a short period of time. I don't know if you had to see the pictures of people in Germany using the german mark as wallpaper because it was so fucking worthless or the pictures of people bringing wheel barrows full of money to pay for a simple piece of bread but it was fucking disgusting. You can say Hitler was a bad guy and you wouldn't be wrong at all, but if anything he was at least partially a product of shit storm that the world decided to bring upon central Europe for their part in World War 1.

For the first time, I strongly agree with you.

[Bear]

Germany suffered a humiliating defeat in WWI. When Hitler and his National-Socialist party was elected, Germany was in a horrible economic situation and they were forbidden from having a military. Germany was weak and suffering.

Some of the people who managed to still be successful in business in Germany were Jewish. Hitler wanted access to Jewish assets. This was easier to do with them in camps or dead.

He also believed the Arian race was physically superior to all other races. He wanted to create a Master Race that would make Germany a world power, the world power in Europe. In order to do this he felt he needed to eliminate other races. He killed Jews and gypsies. He also killed and/or sterilized people with physical or mental defects. He considered homosexuality a defect. He did not want defective people reproducing and weakening the gene pool. He encouraged people he considered ideal physical Arian specimens to reproduce. He gave subsidies to soldiers, their wives, and even single women for having babies if they met his criteria.

Hitler was just trying to help evolution along by his own twisted standards and make a little money in the process.

he was just a good guy? or why like him gays so much?

oh, the nice men in uniform?

[Sachaztan]

he was just a good guy? or why like him gays so much?

oh, the nice men in uniform?

Are you a sentient bot?

[chefarzt]

He was an artist, a painter, so bad noone wanted to buy his shit. So he changed profession.

[Bear]

Pro-Russian demonstrators broke in the Municipal Administration of Ukrainian city of Lugansk
www.focus-fen.net/news/2014/03/09/329507/pro-russian-demonstrators-broke-in-the-municipal-administration-of-ukrainian-city-of-lugansk.html

[chefarzt]

Why dont you just give a fuck, the peons did the revolution, now another generic scumbag takes control.(no shab allowed).

[Bear]

Ukraine will not give up Crimea: acting foreign minister
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/03/08/us-ukraine-crisis-minister-idUSBREA270AB20140308

the ukraine will do a big fail if they thinking the nato will help vs russian.
the ukraine is not a member of the nato and so long russian not bomb poland or a other nato member they will do nothing.
and germany need the russian gas, so the policy will do nothing to, and that is it than...