Hotchkiss Stuka [PE]

[Guest]

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever

Login with username, password and session length

[AlphaTIG]

So EiR is going to be Starcraft now, with all the counters and no multi-purpose units? https://goo.gl/LH3yZc


Anyway, stuka was never self-supporting and no matter how you look at it. Stuka hotchkai was just a hotchkai, but addition of no-damage rockets. Disabling it's main gun and leaving it be 4 rockets on tracks is not so brilliant as you, devs, think.
If you can make it useful without it's maingun, they I'll be the first one to glorify it as a miracle.

I hope you can pull it off.

have you played a game with the stuka hotch yet? bc i dont see any replays posted by you..

play with it before you judge a unit.

i was bombed by stuka hotches and it was not plesant. with sight theyre very accurate (for arty) and deal massive dmg to infantry as well as medium dmg to tanks. However their barrages are quite easy to evade.

but you cant possibly know all that because you played like 2 games lately and there were no stuka hotchkai present.

[Mysthalin]

How you make design changes does not really change my argument though, tank, as it involves a simple like-for-like comparison.

Would you confidently be able to say that the stuka halftrack is a viable unit? If not, then by definition the hotchkiss stuka simply can not be viable as it is a weaker version of the halftrack.
If you can confidently call the stuka halftrack balanced, then the hotchkiss version needs to offer very clear incentives over the halftrack to bridge the gap - a slight price reduction is simply not enough.

That's not theory crafting, it's not a question of how you would like to design the game. It's a simple observation on a comparison of two units that are absolutely like-for-like.

The problem is that people could and did call in 2-4 at a time, and would then barrage your position (usually ganking your ATG even if you tried to GTFO the second you heard the rockets) and proceed to rush in and finish off your infantry/LVs at their leisure. Repeat ad nauseam.

1 M10 dude. 1 single M10. Is all you need.

[Shabtajus]

Ech Mysthalin came here. Sadly you are not a legitimare player anymore. You are like an old lion in jungles who tells stories to youngsters before they go to bed. No tooths no nails no more muscles to do damage. Just old lion.


Rest in peace Mysth

[GrayWolf]

deal massive dmg to infantry as well as medium dmg to tanks.

We might have a different definition of "massive damage" then.

play with it before you judge a unit.

Hotchkai stats weren't touched for so long, Mysth might have the right idea of how bad the rocket barrage is.
The only thing that was changed in a year was a recharge and only by 15%.

I remember playing it a month ago and I don't think that without it's gun it's any better really. Rocket barrage was shitty back then and that wasn't really changed (http://forums.europeinruins.com/index.php?topic=28530.0 - that's the latest hotchkai buff besides the recharge).

If this barrage would be a pin-point on max range, then it would be worth using with it's shitty damage. Just an idea.
Or make it AT rockets with good accuracy.

Also, you can gimme the link to your game, where you deal this "massive damage" so I can see it.

[AlphaTIG]

Hotchkai stats weren't touched for so long, Mysth might have the right idea of how bad the rocket barrage is.
The only thing that was changed in a year was a recharge and only by 15%.

wrong. but those changes arent listed in the patch notes since they're part of the lv reworks. so i cant tell you which exact numbers were changed.

A lot has been changed in penetration, reload speed, damage, health, etc. Try them, remember that they are functionally quite different from how they used to be and give feedback.

Also, you can gimme the link to your game, where you deal this "massive damage" so I can see it.

its in the folder i posted in the replay thread.

either stay up to date with changes and forum posts and actually play matches, or all your posts boil down to theorycrafting w/o any real knoweledge about the units, or in short: bullshit.

i consider this discussion over now. have a bad day sir.

[tank130]

How you make design changes does not really change my argument though, tank, as it involves a simple like-for-like comparison.

Would you confidently be able to say that the stuka halftrack is a viable unit? If not, then by definition the hotchkiss stuka simply can not be viable as it is a weaker version of the halftrack.
If you can confidently call the stuka halftrack balanced, then the hotchkiss version needs to offer very clear incentives over the halftrack to bridge the gap - a slight price reduction is simply not enough.

That's not theory crafting, it's not a question of how you would like to design the game. It's a simple observation on a comparison of two units that are absolutely like-for-like.

1 M10 dude. 1 single M10. Is all you need.

I can't answer you question because I have not had a chance to play against or with either units since the last patch. I played one game against someone with the Hotch Stuka, I would not be wise to base a decision off one game. As we mentioned, there have been some significant changes in the last patch to LV's.

Anywho......as usual we are in discussions right now about possible changes to the hotch stukka and they are slated for the next patch. The changes will be very little, but they will be a change.

I find his whole thread pretty useless to be honest, but I am a sucker for getting involved.

[Shabtajus]

 As we mentioned, there have been some significant changes in the last patch to LV's.

Since i could not get a game lately  i want to ask about changes being made in patch R19. You have mentioned that some of patch changes will not be set for action because of having some problems with SQL coding. Hotfix of R19 had a few changes for GMC's and Hotchkiss Stuka but what about other changes in patch R19? They are activated or still in progress?

[Hicks58]

Everything besides Chaffee addition is now active for R019.

[Shabtajus]

Everything besides Chaffee addition is now active for R019.

reply to my PM hix. Do we have a deal or what?

[tank130]

reply to my PM hix. Do we have a deal or what?

Your request has been denied.

[nikomas]

I would like to note how absolutely worthless the stuka halftrack was before its rockets got changed to actually be able to kill things reliably. IIRC, The Hotchkai didn't get those buffed rockets precisely because was a non doctrinal platform with a decent gun for self defense. The only way to get the rockets to do any decent damage was to select two very specific doctrines in the SE tree or be lucky enough to scatter rockets into a vehicle.

I don't recall the rockets being swapped so without its main gun, it's probably worth less than a single mortar halftrack.

[GrayWolf]

I would like to note how absolutely worthless the stuka halftrack was before its rockets got changed to actually be able to kill things reliably. IIRC, The Hotchkai didn't get those buffed rockets precisely because was a non doctrinal platform with a decent gun for self defense. The only way to get the rockets to do any decent damage was to select two very specific doctrines in the SE tree or be lucky enough to scatter rockets into a vehicle.

I don't recall the rockets being swapped so without its main gun, it's probably worth less than a single mortar halftrack.

+1