Sniper vs Hans

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[Igawa]

Since I don't have any way of seeing what the Allied doctrinal abilities are for snipers, I can't say this with full certainty, but I think that Axis snipers still get better doctrinal abilities. Omniscence and Heavy Support, obviously are the two main contenders here, with conviction/ferocity also to a lesser extent

As an axis player, I don't use snipers much at all unless my doctrine buffs them somehow. I agree that their vet isn't nearly as nice as the allied vet and if there's nothing else going for them in terms of buffs then I'd rather save the expense and spend it on a pair of gren squads and 3-4 lmgs...or shreks. Or 4 more bikes to hunt enemy snipers with...or something.

Actually I wish there were more ways to kill enemy snipers as axis. Our main options are countersnipe, mortar, bike, or lucky pak, and maybe a firestorm/rocket arty if really lucky. Allies get 1sechowie, calliope, mortar, countersnipe, jeep, croc, airborne drop, regular howie, fireup, strafing runs and bombing runs.

Hans really should have become a Luftwaffe ace 

Edit: I forgot I was going to say that most of the time I don't even have a sniper in my companies, for instance none of my terror companies had one during the German Steel era, where there were no buffs on the guy.

[puddin]

uMMM 450 for snipers and 225 mu as well.. its nto to much cheaper

[Tymathee]

heh, so u wont play unless you have buffs, sad. Allied snipers get NO BUFFS whatsoever. So what if it's cheaper, it's only 70 mp and 75 mu cheaper than the axis if you get both upgrades on infantry but airborne and armor dont get it, so please dont go there with me. Thats just sad.

[Absolution]

heh, so u wont play unless you have buffs, sad. Allied snipers get NO BUFFS whatsoever. So what if it's cheaper, it's only 70 mp and 75 mu cheaper than the axis if you get both upgrades on infantry but airborne and armor dont get it, so please dont go there with me. Thats just sad.

And the Axis doesn't get heavy support and dual use medpacks unless they go Terror. Blitzkrieg and Defensive don't get them.

Both sides have one doctrine that buffs their snipers. Ignoring them, as they are in the minority (theoretically), the allied sniper is frankly more effective. Using units that your company doesn't buff isn't the best idea. Play to your strengths, et c...

Oh right, this is Mal on his other account playing as another company because I'm bored.

[Snarks]

Welp, too lazy to type up another Sniper post so I'll just copy and paste this straight from the other thread.

5.5 - 7.5 for Axis.
7.3 - 8.8 for Allies.

axis sniper rifle reloads every 10 shots + 2-2 second reload
american sniper rifle reloads every 5 shots + 3-3 second reload

Some additional information...
-The only factor in determining the accuracy difference between the two Sniper weapons is the Vet 1 (and the Allied Sniper vet 2) reduced incoming accuracy buff.
-Rangers have infantry_elite armor which means Snipers have 100% accuracy against in all scenarios even if they're retreating with Vet 1 and under cover.
-Snipers have a base accuracy of 1 at mid and longe range but an accuracy of .75 at short.

Now regarding vet, the Vet 1 health regen for the Axis Sniper is probably the most useful vet bonus. This is what allows a Sniper to stay on the field indefinitely. Combine health regen with good micro and cover, and you can easily get 20+ kills or 50+ if you're on a good run.

Allied Snipers will usually have alot harder time to keep up. Unless there's a Triage center, the Sniper will probably be out of commission around 15+ kills though I've seen some very well microed Allied Snipers get high kill ratios.

If you have a Volk based army, then your Snipers will probably have the better bang for the buck. If you have a Gren based army, then the enemy Snipers will probably have the better bang for the buck. But if your opponent has a large amount of Rangers then you can probably get the better deal. Just remember that sometimes it's better to remove camo and run for the safety of friendly lines instead of staying camoflagued.

Also, medpacks for Axis Snipers is not really useful. The MU can be better spent elsewhere since Vet 1 health regen is typically enough to bring the Sniper back into fighting conditions.

[gamesguy5]

heh, so u wont play unless you have buffs, sad. Allied snipers get NO BUFFS whatsoever. So what if it's cheaper, it's only 70 mp and 75 mu cheaper than the axis if you get both upgrades on infantry but airborne and armor dont get it, so please dont go there with me. Thats just sad.

And allied snipers get far superior vet, and is better out of the box, and allies have far superior sniper counters in the form of strafing runs, and the jeep with scout.

[Igawa]

=\

Tym, IMO, the axis sniper is quite an expensive unit, and in my mind (and experience) the standard one is not worth it, both in terms of the overall effect on a battle and the effort on the part of the player it takes to keep one alive.

However, I've had some quite good times with my sniper with Omnisence, and to me the bonuses are worth the cost...

I could have gone and gotten walking stuka and large rockets as well with my current doctrine but I didn't, because it just doesn't fit my style. And the cost doesn't appeal to me either, since my resources are already stretched dang thin with this company (though I'm sure I could adapt to stukas pretty quick)

It's not 'sad' that I don't use regular snipers...that's like saying it's 'sad' that someone doesn't have a nebel, kch, m8, flamers, or pumas in their company.

It's all about how much you feel the unit is worth, and if it isn't worth the expense to you, then there's nothing 'sad' about it o.o

[Tymathee]

dude...i just went up against a guy who had a sniper and he kicked our ass. He poped an hmg in a building in less than 5 seconds. Just pop, pop, pop

with allied snipers it's more pop.......pop.........pop. I've also seen more vet 3 snipers on axis than allies, so to say that its' " useless" is retarded. I also see more axis snipers period, so there must be something good about them.

[unem]

I have to call bullshit on that Tym, even with ferocity.


Its kinda obvious;

Same price, by default;

Axis sniper has harder time (higher squad number for allys).
Allyed sniper has better Vet, especially vet. 1.
-_-

[NationalSozialismus]

I just have one Sniper in my company but he's a heavy support sniper so he gets a health buff and range buffs which makes him devastating. That said, he survived a strafing and bombing run this game so I think Hans is a lucky lucky man.

He got 65 kills last game and 14 this game. So I think axis snipers are good as they are... Important thing I think is that axis snipers aren't designed to work alone, allied snipers are designed to sneak around and attack targets of opportunity namely axis snipers.

[NationalSozialismus]

I have to call bullshit on that Tym, even with ferocity.


Its kinda obvious;

Same price, by default;

Axis sniper has harder time (higher squad number for allys).
Allyed sniper has better Vet, especially vet. 1.
-_-

I was the sniper in the game with him, I didn't have a hard time. His snipers couldn't even get in range of me to counter snipe. Many allied units lose against a lone axis sniper.

I've had whole ranger squads die to my sniper as they charged it.....

[DFKR]

I hate you.

[Tymathee]

haha thank you for backing me up on that. And then his ally brought out a sniper and kept our infantry at bay. The fact is, because of the better weapons on axis infantry, it makes the axis sniper really effective vs allied infantry, whereas the allied sniper isn't so good at that because axis infantry can charge right past allied infantry and then use one lmg and tear into a sniper (this has hhappened ot me so many times) you want to know how i found out how good the lmg really is? I one time had a vet 2 airborne squad pick up an lmg and another had a bar, guess which one had the most kills by the time i had to get them out of there? Yes...the lmg guy, he totally kicked ass and picked up 10 kilsl to 3 on the other one.

[UnderpoweredAll]

haha thank you for backing me up on that. And then his ally brought out a sniper and kept our infantry at bay. The fact is, because of the better weapons on axis infantry, it makes the axis sniper really effective vs allied infantry, whereas the allied sniper isn't so good at that because axis infantry can charge right past allied infantry and then use one lmg and tear into a sniper (this has hhappened ot me so many times) you want to know how i found out how good the lmg really is? I one time had a vet 2 airborne squad pick up an lmg and another had a bar, guess which one had the most kills by the time i had to get them out of there? Yes...the lmg guy, he totally kicked ass and picked up 10 kilsl to 3 on the other one.

The BAR has the powerful one time ability, compared to the LMG which has no ability but is more powerful across time.....

NationalistSozialismus = UnderpoweredALL = MannfredvonRitter

[AmPmTLS]

With dual LMGs the grens outdamage rifles with BARs in base DPS. BARs outdamage single LMG Grens though in damage. However, few people put rifles in cover where they gain enough reduction in damage to last a while.

[Absolution]

Dual LMG42 gren squad at long range vs BAR'd riflemen can lose due to its ineffectiveness...

[Akranadas]

I thought we were talking about snipers here?

[Absolution]

Sniper LMG42. I have a picture!

[Tymathee]

yeah yeah dps so what, lmg out performs bars. an lmg guy will kill a sniper faster than a bar guy because of the much longer burst of the lmg.

[gamesguy4]

I have to call bullshit on that Tym, even with ferocity.


Its kinda obvious;

Same price, by default;

Axis sniper has harder time (higher squad number for allys).
Allyed sniper has better Vet, especially vet. 1.
-_-

I was the sniper in the game with him, I didn't have a hard time. His snipers couldn't even get in range of me to counter snipe. Many allied units lose against a lone axis sniper.

I've had whole ranger squads die to my sniper as they charged it.....

All it takes is one strafing run or a couple of scouting jeeps.

2/3 of the American doctrines have those.  Even my raid assault AB company has 2 strafes, and any armor player with a brain has scout.

I use snipers in both my allied and axis companies, the allied one is way better.  It shoots smaller squads, and its target doesnt get a dodge bonus against it.  Vet 1 American infantry can dodge sniper shots, and do so quite often, especially airborne.