[cw] Commando sten vs Soldier armor (PE)

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[Firesparks]

The commando's sten still have their penalty against soldier from VCOH. It's a pretty hefty penalty(.75Acc .5 Dmg) and it make the Commando very weak against the Assault grenadier (and PE against in general.)

I think the modifier should be raised.

[Hicks58]

Commandos are situational units anyhow at the minute...

They can't be used like any other assault infantry due to their paper thin tendencies.

Increasing their effectiveness against Assault Grens really wouldn't help them all that much... Especially when they can beat them down consistently when used correctly already. Use of cover, smoke, or grenades will pretty much guarantee a victory over them, but don't expect much of your squad back unless you really get the drop on them.

[Smokaz]

Im not convinced this change is needed, commandos can take decloaked storms 1v1 using smoke

[NightRain]

Stens must come with a mun cost and mandos for mp cost with rifles

[deadbolt]

Commandos are situational units anyhow at the minute...

They can't be used like any other assault infantry due to their paper thin tendencies.

Increasing their effectiveness against Assault Grens really wouldn't help them all that much... Especially when they can beat them down consistently when used correctly already. Use of cover, smoke, or grenades will pretty much guarantee a victory over them, but don't expect much of your squad back unless you really get the drop on them.

so what your saying with the use of smoke is that mandos are good..... when the other unit cant see them and shoot back at them, lol.

[Firesparks]

Im not convinced this change is needed, commandos can take decloaked storms 1v1 using smoke

since when does storm use soldier armor? I think you meant to post in my other thread

[Hicks58]

so what your saying with the use of smoke is that mandos are good..... when the other unit cant see them and shoot back at them, lol.

That is exactly what I'm saying.

Doesn't say much for Commandos in their current state does it?

[Firesparks]

The commandos is one of the most expensive infantry unit, on par with the ranger + thompson.

However, I would say that the ranger is alot more durable because their Elite armor is just generally superior. In exchange the Commandos get 6 stens compared to the ranger's 4 thompson + 2 rifles.

Commandos do get to air drop, but it's a good question if the extra sten and airdrop compensate for the lack of elite armor.

[AmPM]

Airdrop is negligible, and in the case of AB and FJ more of a downside actually.

Mandos are also too expensive to be used much. Should give them rifles and airdrop and nade. Allow smoke and stens to be purchased.

[Hicks58]

Am I really one of the few people against giving Commandos rifles?

All it will do for them is make them a 6 man Tommy squad with the ability to gilder drop and use smoke.

Now, considering glider dropping is anything but quiet (Therefore useless), and smoke is just a get out of jail free card... Why would you want to use the more manpower expensive (and supply expensive) rifle Commandos over Tommy's who can also get Brens or Rifle Grenades and do their job much more efficiently?

The problem is with the Commandos themselves and their Stens.

Make the Commandos more durable or drop down the munitions cost behind Commandos somwhat... For supposed assault infantry, they can't do their job too well without using a one time gimmick... Or risk using the squad as a one time deal.

Let the unit actually do it's intended role rather than relegating it to a glorified Tommy squad.

[Firesparks]

Im not convinced this change is needed, commandos can take decloaked storms 1v1 using smoke

Against the US, the storm are a bit of a glass cannon. Even The rifle with suppression fire can deal with storm. The storm's main strength is their cloak and alpha strike power.

[AmPM]

Am I really one of the few people against giving Commandos rifles?

All it will do for them is make them a 6 man Tommy squad with the ability to gilder drop and use smoke.

Now, considering glider dropping is anything but quiet (Therefore useless), and smoke is just a get out of jail free card... Why would you want to use the more manpower expensive (and supply expensive) rifle Commandos over Tommy's who can also get Brens or Rifle Grenades and do their job much more efficiently?

The problem is with the Commandos themselves and their Stens.

Make the Commandos more durable or drop down the munitions cost behind Commandos somwhat... For supposed assault infantry, they can't do their job too well without using a one time gimmick... Or risk using the squad as a one time deal.

Let the unit actually do it's intended role rather than relegating it to a glorified Tommy squad.

You dont want to go the way of the FJ? =)

[Hicks58]

You dont want to go the way of the FJ? =)

No, I really don't.

Commandos supposedly have one of the highest short range infantry based DPS's in the game... I'd say this is reflected by the fact that they get absolutely no buffs to their offensive capabilities, hell, the only buff they get worth mentioning is a health buff of 10%/15%... I keep getting it confused with their vet 3 to which it actually is. >.<

I'd rather they be good at their job then be changed into something that wasn't their original purpose.

In vCoH, they are early game shock troops... Being able to mince up most early game infantry piece of cake, and making alright support later on.

Now the stages of game are gone in EiRR, they can't properly reflect their original role, hence, they need to be adapted properly to work in EiRR, as do other units which are primarily aimed at being early game superiority units.

[NightRain]

Commandos are the worst elite unit in game right after Failschrimjägers.

besides Brits would like to have a solid unit with ability to throw grenades without having riflenades or paying 165 + nade price to do it. Mando rifles would as well be better than Sten mandos due to stens weird multipliers

[Mysthalin]

SMGs don't create an assault squad.
Grenades do.

That is why we want commandos to come with rifles - so you can buy an affordable assault squad for the brits. One that has hand grenades.

[Hicks58]

SMGs don't create an assault squad.
Grenades do.

That is why we want commandos to come with rifles - so you can buy an affordable assault squad for the brits. One that has hand grenades.

By your logic then, Riflemen are also assault squads.

Last time I checked an attempt to rush an enemy position with Riflemen meant they got ventilated or chunkified rather quickly.

The very term assault means to attack an enemy position... Doing so with rifles or a paper thin squad is questionable to put it politely. Giving Commandos rifles would make them have rifles and still be paper thin.

I'm still of the opinion that Commandos should be good at their original use rather than just making them something else. After all, isn't EiRR supposed to keep as close to vCoH stats and mechanics as possible?

[AmPM]

Hicks, they stopped that line of thought over a year ago...

[jackmccrack]

I'd say every elite inf takes a certain strategy

Stormies - cunning
FJ - guile -
Commandos - grace
Rangers - strength
Airborne - fortitude

For Commandos you have to be graceful. Challenge yourself to keep them on the field long enough to use their ninja smoke more than once... Challenge yourself to rack up double digit kills, even if they only ambush weapons teams the whole time. They vet up easy because they always kill something. The hardest part is not getting
them killed themselves.

I've never really had a problem with Soldier Armor but maybe it's because I don't throw them against mass PE troops.

[Groundfire]

I'd say every elite inf takes a certain strategy

Stormies - cunning
FJ - guile -
Commandos - grace
Rangers - strength
Airborne - fortitude

For Commandos you have to be graceful. Challenge yourself to keep them on the field long enough to use their ninja smoke more than once... Challenge yourself to rack up double digit kills, even if they only ambush weapons teams the whole time. They vet up east because they always kill something. The hardest part is not getting
them killed themselves.

I've never really had a problem with Soldier Armor but maybe it's because I don't throw them against mass PE troops.

Well put. Ive always taken this approach to elite infantry myself.

[Mysthalin]

Riflemen with grenades are the absolte best assault squad there is, tbfh.
Or rather, no. They give way to faustnade volks.