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Author Topic: Pershing HVAP rounds?  (Read 19095 times)
0 Members and 9 Guests are viewing this topic.
TheIcelandicManiac Offline
Resident forum troll. Fucked unkn0wns mom
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Posts: 6294


« Reply #40 on: March 23, 2011, 12:54:48 pm »

Using Panthers with APCR makes Pershings a Dead man walking so saying a panthers are usless just becouse some people use HVAP You can easyley Combat it with APCR in Another Doctrine if its really annoying you that much.
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BigDick
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« Reply #41 on: March 23, 2011, 12:57:43 pm »

lol right...a few people have HVAP so 80% of wm players uses Tigers? Bullcrap.

they use tigers because it makes no sense to spend fuel for anything else (except bikes and nebels maybe)

panthers are no option when you can have tigers in your doc because panthers are much worse and cost almost the same

p4s suck they get raped by upgunned shermans while heaving much worse AI capabilities than the shermans
why should i buy P4s?

stugs are ok when you spam them and have at least 2 on field all the time
stuhs are shit

the lightvehicles (pumas, flammen ht) are almost useless except upgunned pumas when you face a RCA cromwell spamer
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RikiRude Offline
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« Reply #42 on: March 23, 2011, 02:07:22 pm »

they use tigers because it makes no sense to spend fuel for anything else (except bikes and nebels maybe)

panthers are no option when you can have tigers in your doc because panthers are much worse and cost almost the same

p4s suck they get raped by upgunned shermans while heaving much worse AI capabilities than the shermans
why should i buy P4s?

stugs are ok when you spam them and have at least 2 on field all the time
stuhs are shit

the lightvehicles (pumas, flammen ht) are almost useless except upgunned pumas when you face a RCA cromwell spamer

I don't get it. US players will suicide M-10s to take out a tiger, yet I don't see axis players suiciding any of their units to take out pershings (aside from PE players) I imagine if the team works together and someone does something like bring on 3 upgunned pumas (similar to someone bringing on 2 M-10s) they shouldn't be a problem. Instead it seems like WM players run with their tails between their legs. Or double shreck storms. If you're getting hurt by hvap rounds stop buying tigers!
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8thRifleRegiment Offline
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Posts: 2210



« Reply #43 on: March 23, 2011, 02:14:07 pm »

hey.... riki, maybe becuase axis units cost more.... and all axis units, to become effective need munitions spent on them. while the m10 doesnt, so its kinda of a suicide unit to begin with, im not gunna waste a p4 i septn 140 munitions on just to kill one allied tank. cmon man, get some logic stop posting these irrational things without thinking it thourgh.
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BigDick
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« Reply #44 on: March 23, 2011, 02:19:41 pm »

I don't get it. US players will suicide M-10s to take out a tiger, yet I don't see axis players suiciding any of their units to take out pershings (aside from PE players) I imagine if the team works together and someone does something like bring on 3 upgunned pumas (similar to someone bringing on 2 M-10s) they shouldn't be a problem.

please cross:

[ ] i know that an upgunned puma needs to hit the pershing 5.6x times as often as a M10 need to hit the tiger to do the same amount of damage?
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NightRain Offline
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Posts: 3908



« Reply #45 on: March 23, 2011, 02:20:50 pm »

they use tigers because it makes no sense to spend fuel for anything else (except bikes and nebels maybe)

panthers are no option when you can have tigers in your doc because panthers are much worse and cost almost the same

p4s suck they get raped by upgunned shermans while heaving much worse AI capabilities than the shermans
why should i buy P4s?

stugs are ok when you spam them and have at least 2 on field all the time
stuhs are shit

the lightvehicles (pumas, flammen ht) are almost useless except upgunned pumas when you face a RCA cromwell spamer

P4 Agree
- Being general armor, this piece of equipment sure comes heavy in its munition cost (full upgrade 150 muns) StuGs are 20 mun cheaper but the main point is: Which one gets its engine fixed after a sticky? 90% of the time? Grin This piece loses to Upgun Shermans, mostly and fairs only medicorely vs infantry. It has to hide from ATGs and shiver in fear of stickies.

Panther Disagree
- While this piece is a Specialized medium tank that fairs well in range and in Armored Combat (+ has nice habit of sniping british officers). It is one of the fastest tanks of Wehrmacht army, compareable to a M10 except it comes with a nice cost. You can waste a lot of munition and fuel on this piece. Don't expect to fight vs Pershings though. Very useful in range as it has over 45 range. (47.5). Has one of the best armors of course.

StuH Highly disagree
- This piece is a miniature artillery piece. StuG chasis. Very low anti tank cabilities but this thing- should not be underestimated. It will HURT your infantry if it tries to act tough. Having 2 of these will obliriate most infantry including elite and standard. They have chance of decrewing an atg with 1 shot. Their accuracy however sucks so Attack ground is adviced to get all that accuracy into account.
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Demon767 Offline
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« Reply #46 on: March 23, 2011, 02:23:53 pm »

i want old HEAT rounds. end of story.
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8thRifleRegiment Offline
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« Reply #47 on: March 23, 2011, 02:25:18 pm »

+1 ^ but i doubt it will ever happen
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DarkSoldierX Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 3015



« Reply #48 on: March 23, 2011, 02:30:55 pm »

M10 do way more per shot than a Puma does and it shoots faster.

Plus pershing does 50% increaced dmg vs puma, and only -20% rec acc while puma is on the move.

Puma is NOT a WM suicide counter to the pershing.
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Demon767 Offline
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« Reply #49 on: March 23, 2011, 02:52:57 pm »

I find the most reliable counter to Pershing is a Panther or higher. with this ability it completely negates that. It effectively countering its counters.. take out please
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EliteGren Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 6106


« Reply #50 on: March 23, 2011, 03:00:59 pm »

That's not how it works. It makes it weaker against Panzerschrecks and Paks and stronger against armor (it still loses to King Tigers and Jagdpanthers).
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Demon767 Offline
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EIR Veteran
Posts: 6190



« Reply #51 on: March 23, 2011, 03:06:49 pm »

If it recieved ATG accuracy against infantry then it would be considerbly weaker, which hasnt happened.

You dont even need HVAP rounds anyways, Allied armour performs well without any buffs, why Armour gets HE rounds and HVAP rounds is beyond me.
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EliteGren Offline
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Posts: 6106


« Reply #52 on: March 23, 2011, 03:12:04 pm »

Allied armour performs well without any buffs

Axis armour perform well without any buffs. Why buff them at all?
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Demon767 Offline
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« Reply #53 on: March 23, 2011, 03:45:18 pm »

exactly
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Hicks58 Offline
Development
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« Reply #54 on: March 23, 2011, 04:15:09 pm »

Right, make all units default and have no perks or buffs from the doctrines.

Infact, scrap doctrines altogether. Problem solved.

Next!
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puddin Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 1701



« Reply #55 on: March 23, 2011, 04:37:46 pm »

The community needs to decided something here, BEcause every thread is the same old Bullshit. 

Either The Doctrines Provide very marginal Buffs that Slightly tip the scale of warefare, Or the doctrines completly change how engagments are won and lost. 

When that is determined is when doctrines can be worked on. 

Half the problem is that some want weaker overall doctrines, and the others want very strong doctrines that change how a unit is able ot be worked all together. 
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Puddin' spamtm is soulcrushing... what's hard to understand about that?
chefarzt Offline
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Posts: 1906



« Reply #56 on: March 23, 2011, 05:10:03 pm »

Make em superstrong is ok for me , BUT do it for all doctrines. Some are just over the top atm compared to others.
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Tymathee Offline
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« Reply #57 on: March 23, 2011, 05:58:38 pm »

I still find nothing wrong with hvap pershings exept they rape the current metagame that everyone plays, so course there's going to be more whining.

It makes no sense to me, 80% of the games i play i go against 2 or more tigers, but then I see this thread about a tiger player whining about his tiger being beaten by an hvap pershing, yet i rarely see hvap pershings on my team maybe once or twice since i've been playing against Tiger spam.

So, tell me how ridiculous is it, that a doctrine ability that beats what everyone is playing with is being called OP? It's just total bias.

Now...if the damage is supposed to be 15% yet in rgds like BD showed is 25%, then there's a problem.

15% = 158.125 dmg
25% = 171.875 dmg

Tiger health = 1064
Normal GUn = 7-8 hits to kill (real # 7.7)
15% = 6-7 hits to kill (real # 6.7)
25% = 6-7 hits to kill (real # 6.1)

so, there's not much of a change there between 15 and 25 but the 15%/25% is pretty huge. so changing it back to 15% won't be that big of a deal 1 v 1 but i guess with other stuff hitting it as well, it can make a big difference.
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RikiRude Offline
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« Reply #58 on: March 23, 2011, 07:18:06 pm »

It's like me running rifles into an ostwind to sticky it and having rifles get gibbed and saying the ostwind is OP. Or running shermans into tank hunter units like hetzers and jagds and saying that's OP. You're bringing a knife to a gun fight pretty much.
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chefarzt Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 1906



« Reply #59 on: March 23, 2011, 07:21:34 pm »

Its more like running rifles into volks and getting wtfpwned in 2 seconds.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2011, 07:27:58 pm by chefarzt » Logged
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