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Author Topic: Tiger Ace/JT/Elefant fuel price  (Read 10759 times)
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CrazyWR Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 3616


« on: June 27, 2014, 11:17:27 am »

so a TA costs 700 fuel.

Jagdtiger costs 840 fuel.

Elefant costs 840 fuel.

Why is TA not also 840?  Or similarly, why arent JT and Elefant 700?
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1. New tactics? it's like JAWS, first one in the water dies

RCA-land where shells fall like raindrops and the Captain is an invincible god
Hicks58 Offline
Development
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Posts: 5343



« Reply #1 on: June 27, 2014, 11:24:03 am »

It was done so that you physically cannot have two super heavies in a company.

People were doing things like rolling with a JT/KT.
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I mean I know Obama was the first one in EiR to get a card. and tbfh the Race card is pretty OP. but Romney has the K.K.K., those guys seem to camo anywhere. So OP units from both sides.
At the end of the day, however, stormtroopers finally got the anal invasion with a cactus they have richly deserved for years.
EliteGren Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 6106


« Reply #2 on: June 27, 2014, 11:37:03 am »

And how is running KT/TA any different, Hicks ? That combo is arguably even more lethal, so the jt plus KT argument falls flat on it's ass, yup.
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i prefer to no u
Don't knock it til uve tried it bitchface, this isn't anything like salads version. Besides u said a semois conversion would never work, now look that's the most played map, ohgodwhy.jpg r u map lead
Hicks58 Offline
Development
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Posts: 5343



« Reply #3 on: June 27, 2014, 11:44:40 am »

Well, it's different in that a TA has 1200 HP and Tiger armour, whereas a KT has 2000 HP and Tiger armour -20% incoming penetration.

The whole, super heavies having near enough double the health of the TA. Having to deal with a total of 4000ish extremely hard to penetrate HP was nuts.

TA's are an absolute pain in the ass but don't require special high penetration AT assets to regularly get through.

Yeah, the KT/TA combo is *Lethal* but it'll come down to reasonable means. KT/JT and the likes required pre-meditated levels of AT.

That, and the KT price probably should have gone up when it's speed went up for a while, but meh.

It's Myst's court now.
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CrazyWR Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 3616


« Reply #4 on: June 27, 2014, 04:30:55 pm »

SP is also 700 fuel
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skaffa Offline
Honoured Member
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Posts: 3130


The very best player of one of the four factions.

« Reply #5 on: June 27, 2014, 04:42:59 pm »

What about Slugger tho. 320 fuel?! dafuck so much
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Quote from: deadbolt
bad luck skaffa>  creates best and most played eir maps
                      >  hated for creating best and most played eir maps

Quote from: Tachibana
47k new all time record?

Quote from: deadbolt
Don't knock it til uve tried it bitchface, this isn't anything like salads version. Besides u said a semois conversion would never work, now look that's the most played map, ohgodwhy.jpg r u map lead
GrayWolf Offline
Development
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Posts: 1590



« Reply #6 on: June 27, 2014, 04:43:43 pm »

What about Slugger tho. 320 fuel?! dafuck so much

._.
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TheWindCriesMary Offline
The Ethics Police
EIR Veteran
Posts: 2630


« Reply #7 on: June 27, 2014, 04:48:54 pm »


TA's are an absolute pain in the ass but don't require special high penetration AT assets to regularly get through.

Lol.

Hicks man, I don't know if you haven't played many games with TA's in them used by even semi experienced players... but what has been done to the TA is an abomination that is ruining every game its in.

This unit has been buffed to absurdity and it's a big, big problem.
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Vermillion Hawk: Do you ever make a post that doesnt make you come across as an extreme douchebag?

Just sayin'
EliteGren Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 6106


« Reply #8 on: June 27, 2014, 04:58:06 pm »

I'm pretty sure it having 45 range on HE rounds is a bug, and is the reason it has been so powerful lately
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TheWindCriesMary Offline
The Ethics Police
EIR Veteran
Posts: 2630


« Reply #9 on: June 27, 2014, 05:02:08 pm »

I'm pretty sure it having 45 range on HE rounds is a bug, and is the reason it has been so powerful lately

If that bug also somehow has given it the ridiculous speed, low cost, rate of fire, accuracy and damage it has at the moment then yes I agree with you: it is the reason it has been so powerful lately.
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EliteGren Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 6106


« Reply #10 on: June 27, 2014, 05:12:02 pm »

Those stats were virtually unchanged for a long time. The +5 range to HE was only added recently, and only now after that change is this discussion embarking
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TheWindCriesMary Offline
The Ethics Police
EIR Veteran
Posts: 2630


« Reply #11 on: June 27, 2014, 05:13:20 pm »

Those stats were virtually unchanged for a long time. The +5 range to HE was only added recently, and only now after that change is this discussion embarking

Hicks super buffed the TA. It's at a comically powerful level atm that is completely ruining games and the mod's balance. Last night I used one with LW and i didn't even need any other units on the field because it was so absurdly overpowered.

Also someone just pointed out to me that the +5 range wasn't a bug, and it wasn't just to HE shells. It's all range. That alone would have made it ridiculous even without needing to test it to see.

http://forums.europeinruins.com/index.php?topic=28001.0


Some highlights from this patch include 7x buffs to some units and tripple nerfs to others. Basically a highlight reel of my worst nightmares.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2014, 05:28:53 pm by TheWindCriesMary » Logged
EliteGren Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 6106


« Reply #12 on: June 27, 2014, 05:32:13 pm »

nvm just saw that too, dayum dem buffs
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TheWindCriesMary Offline
The Ethics Police
EIR Veteran
Posts: 2630


« Reply #13 on: June 27, 2014, 05:46:40 pm »

Nothing like a good ole 7x buff to a single unit in one patch to bring about some sweet, sweet balance.

Couple that with a few 3x nerfs to that unit's counters in the same patch and you've got yourself a great new metagame to play a tiger ace in that will last for a few months of hell.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2014, 05:50:07 pm by TheWindCriesMary » Logged
EliteGren Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 6106


« Reply #14 on: June 27, 2014, 05:49:41 pm »

the triple nerf to slugger was probably uncalled for. already weak unit to begin with
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skaffa Offline
Honoured Member
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Posts: 3130


The very best player of one of the four factions.

« Reply #15 on: June 27, 2014, 05:52:19 pm »

Nothing like a good ole 7x buff to a single unit in one patch to bring about some sweet, sweet balance.

Couple that with a few 3x nerfs to that unit's counters in the same patch and you've got yourself a great new metagame to play a tiger ace in that will last for a few months of hell.

but the calculator said it was ok
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Mister Schmidt Offline
Lawmaker
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Posts: 5006



« Reply #16 on: June 27, 2014, 06:20:54 pm »

lol wow that is actually hilarious
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and 6th " Main Thing " is you have to Chant " hare krishna hare krishna krishna krishna hare hare hare rama hare rama rama rama hare hare ".
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TheWindCriesMary Offline
The Ethics Police
EIR Veteran
Posts: 2630


« Reply #17 on: June 27, 2014, 07:03:48 pm »

Now you can see why I get so passionate about the value and necessity of incremental, small changes to individual units over time.
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Hicks58 Offline
Development
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Posts: 5343



« Reply #18 on: June 27, 2014, 07:13:12 pm »

What about Slugger tho. 320 fuel?! dafuck so much

the triple nerf to slugger was probably uncalled for. already weak unit to begin with

I suppose you two are speaking as experienced and frequent users of the Slugger, right?

Ever think it's health got dropped and it's price got increased for a reason? The thing was putting the Firefly to absolute shame for AT performance (and it pretty much still does even after price hiking it, you should take a look at what it's gun is actually capable of damage and penetration wise), and it shouldn't have had the AI accuracy in the first place as it's a dedicated TD.

Hicks super buffed the TA. It's at a comically powerful level atm that is completely ruining games and the mod's balance. Last night I used one with LW and i didn't even need any other units on the field because it was so absurdly overpowered.

Also someone just pointed out to me that the +5 range wasn't a bug, and it wasn't just to HE shells. It's all range. That alone would have made it ridiculous even without needing to test it to see.

http://forums.europeinruins.com/index.php?topic=28001.0


Some highlights from this patch include 7x buffs to some units and tripple nerfs to others. Basically a highlight reel of my worst nightmares.

I take it you say all this whilst remembering the old TA stats off the top of your head then Wind?

The HE round and AP round changes weren't buffs for the most part, they were standardisation for the ammo types because the penetration and damage values were all over the place in the RGD's - The same thing was done to the SP's main gun as it's damage/penetration calculations were a fucking mess.

HE rounds remaining at 45 range was a mistake, I'll hold my hands up to that.

The max speed was put up from a previous 4.5 to 5.0 (Still 0.2 less than a Pershing), so it actually had a noticeable difference in speed over the standard Tiger, and I'd say using LW further exasperated the problem for you Wind.

The health got put up as it was still at the same level as the Tiger (1200), both the SP and TA have more health than their doctrinal equivalents (990 vs 1100, 1200 vs 1400).

The turret rotation went up from 19 (Shock horror, the standard Tiger's pretty dismal turret rotation) to 27 so that the thing actually had a hope in hell of using it's turret with it's increased speed. For reference the PzIV's rotation is 32.

But hey, if you guys need to make yourselves feel better by bad mouthing and slandering me, feel free. Unfortunately it won't accomplish much considering it's Myst who pulls the strings for balance. Now funnily enough I actually approached him and convinced him to go ahead for the position as I was stepping out of it, as I expected him to do a better job than myself...
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aeroblade56 Offline
Development
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Posts: 3871



« Reply #19 on: June 27, 2014, 07:58:40 pm »

but doesnt the tiger ace have better accel and decel than a super pershing?. and better accuracy because of the HE shell types than the super pershing at long range?
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You are welcome to your opinion.

You are also welcome to be wrong.
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