Allied AT.

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[aeroblade56]

As a Wher player, what are your options without unlocks?

Volks/faust = arguably comparable to rifle/sticky in regards to AT
Grens/shrek
Pak 38
STuG
Panther

I don't think that really looks out of whack. It's true the axis have more handheld AT (by one), but I would rather have M10 or M18 over a STuG TBH

Yes but we have the lighter tanks by a fair amount so if they get hit we need to get in and get out.
In my opinion i believe a sticky performs a deffirent role then the Faust. Stickies are meant for The really big heavy tanks for that crit that just destroys them. It doesnt have to range to take down LV. thats why we have zooks but we have to unlock them a s Tier 1-Tier2.

[Poppi]

can we lower the FU given too?
i think heavies on the axis side have this uncanny ability to gib the fuck out of a 310mp 135mu ranger squad in one hit and take out a sherman without a thought. granted 60mu sticky. but to be so near to inf squad is your own fault.

[AmPM]

can we lower the FU given too?
i think heavies on the axis side have this uncanny ability to gib the fuck out of a 310mp 135mu ranger squad in one hit and take out a sherman without a thought. granted 60mu sticky. but to be so near to inf squad is your own fault.

It's A: Your own fault for putting Rangers in front of the best AI tank in the game and B: Your own fault for not countering it with a SINGLE M10/M18.

Balance should not be changed based around poor players inability to successfully play the game.

[Poppi]

It's A: Your own fault for putting Rangers in front of the best AI tank in the game and B: Your own fault for not countering it with a SINGLE M10/M18.

Balance should not be changed based around poor players inability to successfully play the game.

missed mostly what i was saying. B can fail too (even in vacum) b/c that AI tank isnt just for AI it can take out an m18. Point being MU isnt as vital when FU fills you AI and AT in one vehicle.

If u are MU dependent b/c of ATGs, tommyguns, or RR, your fucked. Especially AB

my fault for not inf spamming i guess.

[AmPM]

missed mostly what i was saying. B can fail too (even in vacum) b/c that AI tank isnt just for AI it can take out an m18. Point being MU isnt as vital when FU fills you AI and AT in one vehicle.

If u are MU dependent b/c of ATGs, tommyguns, or RR, your fucked. Especially AB

my fault for not inf spamming i guess.

A Tiger, in a vacuum, will never kill an M18. It might kill an M10 if you don't have a spotter. That extra 5 range is HUGE. The only Axis tanks that can fight off TDs are the KT and the Panther.

[CrazyWR]

see, this entire thread fails because people don't realize the single best unit americans can get is a 57mm.  More 80gunz, less qq.  Thanks.


As someone who's played armor company for over a year in EIR almost exclusively when I'm playing allies, I can tell you using handheld AT is NOT needed. 

[aeroblade56]

see, this entire thread fails because people don't realize the single best unit americans can get is a 57mm.  More 80gunz, less qq.  Thanks.


As someone who's played armor company for over a year in EIR almost exclusively when I'm playing allies, I can tell you using handheld AT is NOT needed. 

thats a terrible argument. allied already have the atg gun they dont need any other atg. right okay so lets get circle strafed by lolzy pe all day. thats like axis dont need anymore at we have a pak. but yet we have a 88,faust,schreks. or you have 3 heavy tanks that perform the same role.

[DarkSoldierX]

Americans don't need non-doc handheld AT.

Why must we go through this again. If we give allies this then wher is going to get sticky clone.... then allies will gain non-doc heavy tank.... then axis will gain powerful LV's........ and on and on and on.


Americans operate just fine with the weakness. Plus, each doc gives handheld AT to help shore up that weakness to flanking LVs. It may not be cheap to field some of them like AB and Rangers, but if you really think its necessary its at your disposal.

[AmPM]

thats a terrible argument. allied already have the atg gun they dont need any other atg. right okay so lets get circle strafed by lolzy pe all day. thats like axis dont need anymore at we have a pak. but yet we have a 88,faust,schreks. or you have 3 heavy tanks that perform the same role.

PE is completely shut down by your TDs. Not to mention LVs and you can protect your ATG with any other AT unit and kill PE out to 60 range.

Just because you fail does not make Americans weak.

[CrazyWR]

you know that tip when the game is loading that says, ALWAYS MAINTAIN 2 FORMS OF AT ON THE FIELD AT ALL TIMES, YOU'LL BE GLAD YOU DID?

work on that.  If the enemy has more than 1 vehicle on the field, make sure you have more than 2 pieces of AT on the field.  I don't know man, all I know is its very rare that I have trouble handling enemy vehicles as americans unless I'm doing something retarded like spamming only zooks, I don't know how Lionel can function that way, but anyways....use 57s and sprinkle in some stickies and if thats not enough, use 3-6 tank destroyers as needed.  Don't use the tank destroyers as suicide units...and always try to spot for your at units...

[smurfORnot]

then axis will gain powerful LV's........ and on and on and on.

puma with Pz2 gun?! Yes please!

[NightRain]

puma with Pz2 gun?! Yes please!

+1

[8thRifleRegiment]

Usefull puma? what is this nonsense

[Ahnungsloser]

Usefull puma? what is this nonsense

Puma's had to be still useless.  *?*

[Hicks58]

Btw AmPM, you are aware that on the correct terrain you can effectively add anywhere between 5-15 extra range to most high profile tank weapons? By high profile, I don't mean effectiveness, I mean height of the tank. Sherman's (FF especially), Tigers, KT's and so on.

This is done by use of attack ground and allowing the missed round to go over the intended point and scatter into the desired target. It's a hell of a dice roll, but it can work out with lower scatter units.

Level ground with no obstacles can allow for anywhere between 5-10 more potential range while downhill rounds can do some pretty silly things.

This can also be done with ATG's but due to the whacky horizontal scatter it's rare for it to pay off. However, with tanks I've had more than one occasion where I've force fired a round as they skit out of max range to get the kill shot they thought they so craftily avoided.

Any obstacles instantly negate this tactic as scatter rounds will always collide with them if they cross their path. Uphill's do the same. Level or slightly declined ground free of obstacles however?... Don't be shy, take that chance.

The point of outlining all that? It means that units which are normally out-ranged by small margins can close the gap without having to move, through knowledge and use of the game engine.

[AmPM]

Of course, but it goes both ways. Meaning you cam squeeze out rediculous ranges with TDs. Also, once the firing starts you cam back away and even if tooi move slightly out of range it will still for.

[Hicks58]

Funnily enough, the Tiger's higher profile means that the M18 and Tiger will have roughly equal scatter ranges.

In that match up, it's all about how many rounds will penetrate, and how many it will take to do the job.

That's three rounds that WILL penetrate compared to 7-8 rounds at a 35% chance to penetrate.

Pretty sure the Tiger will come out on top with that war of attrition.

[AmPM]

Funnily enough, the Tiger's higher profile means that the M18 and Tiger will have roughly equal scatter ranges.

In that match up, it's all about how many rounds will penetrate, and how many it will take to do the job.

That's three rounds that WILL penetrate compared to 7-8 rounds at a 35% chance to penetrate.

Pretty sure the Tiger will come out on top with that war of attrition.

The difference being that the M18/M10 can engage at 45 with certainty of hitting and move at the same time. Whereas the Tiger has to rely on scatter to hit a fast moving target. Tiger will lose, I've done that fight so many times on both sides.

That doesn't make the Tiger a bad unit, it just means that vanilla American AT can handle Axis units.

[Hicks58]

Take average penetration into account and the M18 is going to have to do that what, 20-24 times?

Tiger just needs three lucky hits.

The point I'm putting across is that by using situation, circumstance and timing, the Tiger is capable of putting down a Hellcat. I'm aware of the reality that in most circumstances the Hellcat will come out on top due to common major errors on the Tiger user's part.

[Ahnungsloser]

loll, I failed to micro a 50% M18 Hellcat  against a Hotchkiss in the last game. (Okay there we're serious pathing errors )

Now, someone should explain me how it is possible to beat a Tiger with a full health M18 Hellcat?
Reply in this thread with a included replay while where everyone can see this. At least it should be a fair battle.
(no damaged engine, no maingun loss for the Tiger or other weird stuff. )

You will be honoured with a virtual High-Five.