Allies and Brit are too OP

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[Ticker44]

I just ended a game with 3 v 3 battle Against two allies and a Brit Faction on Bastion.

   As with most games it did not end well for me and my team mates.

     As a Defence doctrine my tank pool is small, so I can only field a very small compliment of tanks, to be specific either 4 stugs or 3 panzer 4 or 2 panthers. My infantry pool is large but my munitions restrict me from equipping most of them with anything.
     I can field some good support units but they are useless and a waste of time without protection.

   While I love this mod and it makes the game far better, I feel that the balance issues from the vanilla COH have simply been compounded here. Axis tanks are expensive, but I do not see why they are so when I see Shermans deal more damage and take less from a Panzer 4 than what should be the opposite if I have to pay more. I have seen a single Allied company field 5 separate Sherman's in its varients as well as field a number of infantry that I apparently cant.
 
    Vanilla COH had this balance of supposed quality vs quantity, but when my Panzer 4 can be taken out my the cheapest American and British tank easily, I wonder if Axis has quality at all.

     I try to see some sort of balance of power, but when Allied and Brit players whose specialties are not tank or infantry but can field more of the than me, with which they have practically equipped all of them with some extra equipment, I cant see the point playing. I have lost more than I have won and most of those losses I feel came out of nowhere with a sudden surge of tanks and infantry hordes that they had the luxury of holding back while I have to deploy my best units just to compensate for their high numbers and specialt weapons.

    I am simply saying the balance and unit stats (including suppresion, dps, range) that is currently in play does not work for Axis. If I lose a vet 3 grenadier with 2 Lmgs squad, in light cover, to two no vet airborne with heavy machine gun and recoiless rifle, in no cover, I'm not seeing the quality vs quantity.

[XIIcorps]

defensive doctine is about buffing your inf, 88's gaining arty barrage, paks gaining range + sight. if you want a tank coy use blitz

[Hicks58]

Defensive doctrine is one of the most heavily buffed Axis doctrines atm, matched only by Terror.

Use Officers with area effect supervision with your infantry - Tanks should be used as support, not as mainline units.

If you want to focus on tank use, go Blitz.

[XIIcorps]

I just ended a game with 3 v 3 battle Against two allies and a Brit Faction on Bastion.

   As with most games it did not end well for me and my team mates.

     As a Defence doctrine my tank pool is small, so I can only field a very small compliment of tanks, to be specific either 4 stugs or 3 panzer 4 or 2 panthers. My infantry pool is large but my munitions restrict me from equipping most of them with anything.
     I can field some good support units but they are useless and a waste of time without protection.

   While I love this mod and it makes the game far better, I feel that the balance issues from the vanilla COH have simply been compounded here. Axis tanks are expensive, but I do not see why they are so when I see Shermans deal more damage and take less from a Panzer 4 than what should be the opposite if I have to pay more. I have seen a single Allied company field 5 separate Sherman's in its varients as well as field a number of infantry that I apparently cant.
 
    Vanilla COH had this balance of supposed quality vs quantity, but when my Panzer 4 can be taken out my the cheapest American and British tank easily, I wonder if Axis has quality at all.

     I try to see some sort of balance of power, but when Allied and Brit players whose specialties are not tank or infantry but can field more of the than me, with which they have practically equipped all of them with some extra equipment, I cant see the point playing. I have lost more than I have won and most of those losses I feel came out of nowhere with a sudden surge of tanks and infantry hordes that they had the luxury of holding back while I have to deploy my best units just to compensate for their high numbers and specialt weapons.

    I am simply saying the balance and unit stats (including suppresion, dps, range) that is currently in play does not work for Axis. If I lose a vet 3 grenadier with 2 Lmgs squad, in light cover, to two no vet airborne with heavy machine gun and recoiless rifle, in no cover, I'm not seeing the quality vs quantity.

exactly as hicks put it, go blitz for tanks.

Defense doctrine dosent buff tanks much, blitz on the other hand makes even the lowly stug a wrecking ball.

And cromwells rarely beat P4's in a fight unless the croms allowed to circle straife, or has RCA buffs to its dmg, pen and range

[Hicks58]

Honestly, it sounds like you're simply suffering from new guy syndrome.

In the EiRR environment, EVERYTHING will look OP when you face off against it for the first time. This is compounded by the fact you are usually facing experienced players off the bat.

Trust me when I say that the only doctrines which are truly "Bad" are Airborne and Commandos. Every other doctrine has functional set ups that WILL hold their ground when pitted against the others.

But even then, there are one or two builds for Airborne and Commandos that can work too... So long as your opponent is not expecting it.

[XIIcorps]

i was in the game he played hicks and both teams  had one player annihilated, it didnt really come down to the wire, but it was a close game.

Battle 1508

                      Inf KD/R    Vech KD/R

Codesaidafter     76  77       6   6
XIICorps            60  67       16  4
Hitlersfury         42  101      5   5

Kipsinas             69  76      7   12
Laifs                  84 56       6   9
Madman58         82  58       2   9

[panzerman]

also playing axis is a little harder as the allies are starting to take more of the warmap, but you need to be bringing atg for tanks, unless you go heat rounds p4's are useless against tanks in all but a supporting role.

and 2 panthers used to be a good amount of mobile AT but current meta game see them to be sadly not at their former glory.

[Mysthalin]

*Barely suppressed rage about misconceptions that do not fit statistics*

[Hicks58]

Let it out Myst.

I could do with cracking open another bag of popcorn.

[Mysthalin]

I spent 60 hours in the past 3 days analyzing statistical data incongruences in international trade.

I think I'm set for discussing stats for a while.

[Shabtajus]

wtf?

[Mysthalin]

Final year at uni bro... Sometimes things like a social life and basic necessities for survival such as sleep need to be given up on for a while.

[Shabtajus]

fair enough

[Smokaz]

+1 to Ticker (pun intended)

Wehr lmg is too puny and uninteresting

[RikiRude]

First off welcome to the mod! Second prepare to lose 90% of time for your first 30 games, unless you were a level 12 or something in vcoh, eirr is an uphill battle. But trust me its worth it! I'm going togo ahead and agree with what everyone said and also say if you see my defensive company you will see what it can do.

Defensive is about buffing infantry, support, and Intel or line of sight. It's also the only kind of arty doctrine that wm has had.

You either use buffed support weapons and officer. Or you set up arty 88s or you go bottom t4 and use bikes and mortars and snipers to take big advantage of your sight.

One thing you don't do is focus on tanks heh.

[Tymathee]

did you try playing as allies and brits before you say OP?

also, you tried to play tanks with the defensive faction...

If you want to buff your p4's, play with Blitz or even Terror, defensive focuses on support weapons, artillery and infantry.

Also, you're new, and ifyou play against EIR vets, you're more than likely going to get defeated by someone else thats even played a month or two longer than you.

[Valexandes]

Take a look through the replays section and watch some. It gives you a great idea of what units go well with each other and how to handle them based on all the EIR bonuses and the matchups you'll see in EIR that don't happen in VCOH.

[ick312]

dear ticker,

welcome to EIRR. Yes your impression is right: usually axis have good quality vs allied quantity.

The current balance situation doesnt reflect that idea. I know how you feel, you show by far more skill and a smart company build and you lose. You are not losing against the player - you are clearly losing against his units, which are at least competetive strong, but cheaper. After the match you get hard trolled and considered as one of the bad players. Honestly i feel with you bro.

Let me tell you my personal feelings about this:
EIRR is by far the best game i ever played. Its actually not a mod, its a new game. The developers did a great work!
but i also got to be honest about the problems of this mod: a very bad community and bad balance. both things ruin the whole game.
and i am frustrated about this. neither arguments based on logic, statistics or experience count here, when you made a balance thread. The rule is that you get trolled really hard, and that by players who lost against you, when there was a balance (or sometimes even by guys who are still losing against you).
Please dont think that anything will change: many allied players get used to the current balance and consider themselfs as good players. believe me: it will be that players, that will cry on the forums if the game is balanced again.

Me for my part i learned a lot and maybe you can profit from my experiences with this community:
1. i played each game- i trained a lot of new guys, i never doged => dont do that, they will fool you and the game rewards only winning. so search games where you clearly bash bad players
2. dont post on the forums sth. serious => you are just fooled (even if you are right)
3. get a buddy, who fits to your playstyle and share the victories with him
4. dont expect justice in moderation: you might get banned, even if you never fooled somebody and made good arguments. While others whose only reason, why they answer you, is to insult and fool.
5. the majority of the member of this mod might be idiots, but please keep manners.

[hans]

hmm

firt of all: play allies and try it out if it really is their super powerful shit that makes the decision between win and loose

second: i dont want to judge if either allies or axis have an advantage these days, it is normal that fresh new players do lack experience and skill in the battles and therefore get the feeling that everything that beats them is overpowered.

third: try out allies and tell us ur experience. I bet it wont be different. A tip, just review all ur replays and check out the ones on the forum to learn and get experience in different situations. Even though u thought fighting sherman with p4 is good, think about the counters to armour. The medium tank p4 is A: alone not effective against the sherman, more the opposite, so not the counter and B: if u have to fight with the p4 always do that in the combination of other AT units available like paks and so on. SO go and learn how to counter units and more learn to counter strategies + get experience.

i hope that helpes and welcome to the mod yo ^^

[chefarzt]

Mann Hans ab in die Ecke und Eselsmütze auf!!!!
Essen gibts morgen.
Aber nur wenn du brav bist.