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Topic: Goliath (Read 33861 times)
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TheWindCriesMary
The Ethics Police
EIR Veteran
Posts: 2630
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #100 on:
November 30, 2012, 03:34:41 pm »
Quote from: RikiRude on November 30, 2012, 03:20:33 pm
Also I'd like to comment that game doesn't show shabs main goliath spam company, i am pretty sure that was a company he made on the spot to try something a bit new.
I'm sorry Riki, but Shab's goliath company is not a threat to anyone in a decently balanced game.
Goliaths are a huge lesson in two thins: the psychological hysteria of some people in this mod when they encounter something that disrupts the nice clean routine of their favoured style of gameplay, and the horrible cost-vs-impact analysis that some players use when using strategies like Goliaths. The former affects allies going against something like goliath spam, and the other the people who use it.
If someone wants to spend all those munitions to kill 3-5 riflemen (40 mp each), i'm more than happy with that trade. If you kill only that much with a goliath, shame on you for your target priorities.
Logged
Quote from: EIRRMod on April 30, 2012, 07:08:25 pm
Vermillion Hawk: Do you ever make a post that doesnt make you come across as an extreme douchebag?
Just sayin'
tank130
Sugar Daddy
Posts: 8889
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #101 on:
November 30, 2012, 04:10:02 pm »
this thread is a perfect example of why the dev team ignores most of the community balance threads........
Logged
Quote
Geez, while Wind was banned I forgot that he is, in fact, totally insufferable
Quote from: Hicks58 on June 05, 2013, 02:14:06 pm
I'm not going to lie Tig, 9/10 times you open your mouth, I'm overwhelmed with the urge to put my foot in it.
TheIcelandicManiac
Resident forum troll. Fucked unkn0wns mom
Posts: 6294
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #102 on:
November 30, 2012, 04:22:26 pm »
Quote from: RikiRude on November 30, 2012, 03:20:33 pm
I have to lol at your comment ice. dont retreat rifles, ok thats easy enough, end up with 2-3 guys left? not really, with terror goliaths you are lucky if you are left with just just 1-2 guys, which are useless outside of capping.
stopping your tank to shoot goliath? this is a pretty huge risk imo, so if you miss that goliath you just shrug your shoulders as your tank takes 70% damage from it?
though the atgs pointing on the roads is a good tactic. your other two claims, not so much.
Also I'd like to comment that game doesn't show shabs main goliath spam company, i am pretty sure that was a company he made on the spot to try something a bit new.
You are a bloddy idiot blowing things out of proportion.
70%?
At most its going to do 20-30% and even then if you are going to back up like an idiot with your terrible micro you are just going to get your sherman stuck on a twig and in the end having the Gol blow up the sherman anyways because you failed to think ahead and not retreateing your troops is effective of a strat because even 7 rifles against 5 volks is better than 5 rifles agains 5 volks.
Also, Have you also ever thought about not blobbing like an idiot?
«
Last Edit: November 30, 2012, 04:25:22 pm by TheIcelandicManiac
»
Logged
Quote from: Grundwaffe
Soon
Quote from: Shabtajus on May 18, 2013, 02:16:45 am
gj icelandic i am proud of u
Quote from: aeroblade56 on June 21, 2013, 11:47:37 am
Sometimes its like PQ doesnt carrot all.
Work Harder
Ahnungsloser
Donator
Posts: 1447
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #103 on:
November 30, 2012, 06:34:02 pm »
Quote from: TheIcelandicManiac on November 30, 2012, 04:22:26 pm
You are a bloddy idiot blowing things out of proportion.
70%?
There not a single vehicle which has more then 70% health left when it gets hit by a goliath in it's low-mid range area of effect.
A Urban Survival Kit Pershing or a Churchill with buffs will slighty breach the 70% mark. (Or with veterancy)
Logged
9th Armoured Engineers
Mysthalin
Tired King of Stats
Posts: 9028
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #104 on:
November 30, 2012, 07:34:06 pm »
Quote from: TheWindCriesMary on November 30, 2012, 03:09:33 pm
Yes, the reason I'm dismantling your terribly illogical argument
must
be "just because I like snipers". Otherwise I'd be completely fine with horribly poor, completely non-sensical arguments in support of altering the mod.
Ok, which part of my argument is illogical?
The fact tanks (baring the KT) have a fire-aim time, or the fact that snipers re-cloak a lot quicker than a tank can reload?
Your argument rests on an idealistic "since when is simple in-game AI not being a pain to the player for no discernible reason been an incentive for us to change anything?". Since this is a ridiculously shitty ideal to uphold, and I'm certain you're much too smart to suggest we should uphold nuisances for the good of a shitty ideal, my conclusion is that you're arguing because you don't want snipers to get even a minuscule chance of being killed due to a change that would improve play-ability.
By all that is holy to a shitty liberal arts student, will you finally accept that the reasoning found in the writings of retarded absolutist philosophers is not applicable anywhere beyond 2nd year PPE?
Logged
PonySlaystation
EIR Veteran
Posts: 4136
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #105 on:
December 01, 2012, 09:24:54 am »
Quote from: TheWindCriesMary on November 30, 2012, 03:34:41 pm
If someone wants to spend all those munitions to kill 3-5 riflemen (40 mp each), i'm more than happy with that trade. If you kill only that much with a goliath, shame on you for your target priorities.
200 MP and 80 MU is more than enough for a Goliath to make up for it's cost.
Quote from: TheIcelandicManiac on November 30, 2012, 04:22:26 pm
not retreateing your troops is effective of a strat
Why would the Goliath only kill a few men when it can kill the entire squad??
«
Last Edit: December 01, 2012, 09:28:22 am by PonySlaystation
»
Logged
Sharks are not monsters Henley, they are cute, cuddly and misunderstood. They love humans. sometimes they love TOO much. They love people so much that sometimes their kisses separate people into two flailing pieces which are consumed by other sharks in a frenzy of peace and joy.
TheIcelandicManiac
Resident forum troll. Fucked unkn0wns mom
Posts: 6294
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #106 on:
December 01, 2012, 10:06:15 am »
Because the turn rate of the goliath is terrible, all you need to do to drag a few guys out of the splash is to run 90° in any direction from where the goliath is coming from and wait for it to blow up.
on the other hand people have the habit of blowing them up before the ideal time comes to pass or after and leave a few injured but alive troops to fight on.
also you can if you are in a good enough situation block the goliath with one squad of for example vanilla rifles so the other squad can run away.
Logged
PonySlaystation
EIR Veteran
Posts: 4136
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #107 on:
December 01, 2012, 10:08:45 am »
The turn rate is only slow when it's standing still.
Logged
TheIcelandicManiac
Resident forum troll. Fucked unkn0wns mom
Posts: 6294
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #108 on:
December 01, 2012, 10:11:20 am »
Well the turn rate is the same, the only diffrence is the speed its going allready and if the speed of the goliath is fast enough its going to miss the squad or tank its going after unless it stops to recalculate the pathing.
Logged
PonySlaystation
EIR Veteran
Posts: 4136
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #109 on:
December 01, 2012, 10:13:03 am »
The Goliath can run around in a circle just like any tank.
Logged
RikiRude
Donator
Posts: 4376
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #110 on:
December 01, 2012, 12:33:32 pm »
Oh man I totally meant 40% not 70% btw lol. But either way, you are right it is closer to 25% depending on the tank.
Logged
Quote from: Killer344
Killer344: "Repent: sory no joke i just had savage diorea"
Quote from: Malgoroth on October 10, 2011, 05:03:49 pm
... or a fat ass cock sucking churchill being stupid
Spartan_Marine88
EIR Veteran
Posts: 4838
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #111 on:
December 01, 2012, 12:37:28 pm »
Quote from: tank130 on November 30, 2012, 04:10:02 pm
this thread is a perfect example of why the dev team ignores most of the community balance threads........
they never will understand tank, not ever.
Logged
Quote from: Sachaztan on March 24, 2013, 03:49:43 pm
Yes that's me, the special snowflake.
TheIcelandicManiac
Resident forum troll. Fucked unkn0wns mom
Posts: 6294
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #112 on:
December 01, 2012, 01:19:15 pm »
Quote from: RikiRude on December 01, 2012, 12:33:32 pm
Oh man I totally meant 40% not 70% btw lol. But either way, you are right it is closer to 25% depending on the tank.
Yea you are true with the 40% thing on some tanks but with those tanks like the cromm or m10 but with them you can with ease out run em.
Logged
Hicks58
Development
Posts: 5343
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #113 on:
December 01, 2012, 02:23:23 pm »
As much fun as it is to watch people throw around inaccurate percentages...
The Goliath deals 375 damage. Shermans have 636 health, M10's 400, Hellcats 500 and Greyhounds 300.
That 375 damage is dealt in an area of 4 units (Short range) whilst medium range goes up to 6 units doing 0.8 damage (Still a respectable 300 damage).
So yeah, LV's are outright destroyed and medium tanks are left feeling the burn when 60%+ of their health disappears.
The only Allied tanks which do not suffer critical damage from a short range Goliath hit would be Churchill variants and the Pershing - But both of these still take significant damage (Pershing 990 health, Churchill MK VI 700, Churchill Croc 900).
As for the out-running part, Goliaths have a max speed of 5.5, but have an accel of 8 and decel of 12. Unless you happen to already be mobile, chances are the Goliath will get you unless you destroy it.
Logged
Quote from: brn4meplz on November 05, 2012, 10:45:05 am
I mean I know Obama was the first one in EiR to get a card. and tbfh the Race card is pretty OP. but Romney has the K.K.K., those guys seem to camo anywhere. So OP units from both sides.
Quote from: Mysthalin on March 27, 2014, 04:57:09 pm
At the end of the day, however, stormtroopers finally got the anal invasion with a cactus they have richly deserved for years.
nikomas
Shameless Perv
Posts: 4286
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #114 on:
December 01, 2012, 02:27:48 pm »
Was going to write what above post said, but then hicks beat me to it.
Anyway, two goliaths can kill pretty much anything but a heavy if you blow them up in their close range, barring usk/vet
«
Last Edit: December 01, 2012, 02:30:39 pm by nikomas
»
Logged
"You can always count on Americans to do the right thingafter they've tried everything else."
Quote from: PonySlaystation
The officer is considerably better than a riflemen squad at carrying weapons.
Officers have good accuracy so they will hit most targets.
Ahnungsloser
Donator
Posts: 1447
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #115 on:
December 01, 2012, 02:49:10 pm »
Quote from: Hicks58 on December 01, 2012, 02:23:23 pm
As much fun as it is to watch people throw around inaccurate percentages...
The Goliath deals 375 damage. Shermans have 636 health, M10's 400, Hellcats 500 and Greyhounds 300.
That 375 damage is dealt in an area of 4 units (Short range) whilst medium range goes up to 6 units doing 0.8 damage (Still a respectable 300 damage).
So yeah, LV's are outright destroyed and medium tanks are left feeling the burn when 60%+ of their health disappears.
The only Allied tanks which do not suffer critical damage from a short range Goliath hit would be Churchill variants and the Pershing - But both of these still take significant damage (Pershing 990 health, Churchill MK VI 700, Churchill Croc 900).
As for the out-running part, Goliaths have a max speed of 5.5, but have an accel of 8 and decel of 12. Unless you happen to already be mobile, chances are the Goliath will get you unless you destroy it.
Finally. I was waiting for your post and I appreciate it. A Pershing getting hit from a Goliath in midrange ((990-300)/990) which is less then 70% health left. The most underestimate the damage output of a goliath.
Logged
3rdCondor
Donator
Posts: 1536
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #116 on:
December 01, 2012, 03:04:39 pm »
It needs a pool increase.
Logged
Quote from: Alpha TIG on August 08, 2012, 11:55:14 pm
No tits, but i will bake a cake then eat it in honour of Sir Condor The 3rd
Quote from: Smokaz on August 14, 2012, 04:15:58 pm
fuck the pgren rifle, fucking dogshit weapon
Quote from: TheIcelandicManiac on November 28, 2012, 04:04:22 pm
My beautiful black pussy won
RikiRude
Donator
Posts: 4376
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #117 on:
December 01, 2012, 06:20:28 pm »
Quote from: Hicks58 on December 01, 2012, 02:23:23 pm
As much fun as it is to watch people throw around inaccurate percentages...
The Goliath deals 375 damage. Shermans have 636 health, M10's 400, Hellcats 500 and Greyhounds 300.
That 375 damage is dealt in an area of 4 units (Short range) whilst medium range goes up to 6 units doing 0.8 damage (Still a respectable 300 damage).
So yeah, LV's are outright destroyed and medium tanks are left feeling the burn when 60%+ of their health disappears.
The only Allied tanks which do not suffer critical damage from a short range Goliath hit would be Churchill variants and the Pershing - But both of these still take significant damage (Pershing 990 health, Churchill MK VI 700, Churchill Croc 900).
As for the out-running part, Goliaths have a max speed of 5.5, but have an accel of 8 and decel of 12. Unless you happen to already be mobile, chances are the Goliath will get you unless you destroy it.
keep in mind hicks the people spamming goliaths are using terror goliaths which add +10% damage to the goliath.
Logged
Shabtajus
EIR Veteran
Posts: 2564
The very best player of one of the four factions.
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #118 on:
December 02, 2012, 04:36:26 am »
why dont u guys go and spam goliaths? just go and play. than comeback and post how "OP" its ffs. Some games in a row few guys tryed spamm them playing vs me and i bet they got so disapointed tbh. and lately guys bringing some good counters vs goli spam so that means they adapt for example colosus he disabled ma coy few times by bringing right counters. what i am trying to say if u cant adapt to a game style its ur own personal problem. still remember when skaffa was using storms + p4s or mysth bofors + mk churchills but hey i did not came to forums with begings nerf this nerf that cuz i cant win.
after all L2P argument is the best answer to complains
Logged
Quote from: TheWindCriesMary on April 08, 2013, 11:10:04 am
I feel like if Smokaz and Shab met up it would be a 50/50 tossup to see which one of them robbed the other first.
Quote from: Hicks58 on May 04, 2013, 01:59:39 pm
Tries to convince people he's a good guy,says things like this. Scumbag Shab.
Hicks58
Development
Posts: 5343
Re: Goliath
«
Reply #119 on:
December 02, 2012, 05:24:58 am »
You're right.
There ARE counters to Goliaths. However, with every spam build that is made, an underlying issue with a unit is brought to light. Sometimes it's a glaring issue, sometimes it's a subtle issue.
With the Goliath, it's just the fact that you can have so many of them and still an effective company in field at the same time, as well as sorting out the priorities on it. No changes to how the unit is used or what the unit is capable needs to be done, it just needs in my opinion, a bit of a pop increase so you can't throw hordes of the buggers out in field whilst having a load of support weapons too.
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