Home
Forum
Search
Login
Register
Account
Welcome,
Guest
. Please
login
or
register
.
Did you miss your
activation email?
November 08, 2024, 04:20:44 am
1 Hour
1 Day
1 Week
1 Month
Forever
Login with username, password and session length
Resources
Leaderboards
Unit Price Lists
Map List
Launcher status:
Players in chat: 2
Battles in progress:
Battles waiting:
Download the mod from Steam
Join our Discord server
Recent posts
LS-DREAMS DOWNLOAD GOLDBE...
by
thinhdqt1291
[
Yesterday
at 02:30:18 pm]
Испытайте зах...
by
Fatimaciz
[November 06, 2024, 03:32:19 pm]
RINDEX YANDEX DISK RINDEX...
by
JRodriguez17
[November 06, 2024, 05:29:25 am]
Hello, New guy in the mod
by
JRodriguez17
[November 06, 2024, 05:28:38 am]
Please dont open this th...
by
Olazaika1
[November 01, 2024, 12:46:37 pm]
Required age ratings for ...
by
Unkn0wn
[October 05, 2024, 07:29:20 am]
50 minutes cap victory
by
Olazaika1
[September 05, 2024, 01:54:13 pm]
Feedback
by
Olazaika1
[July 16, 2024, 11:30:34 pm]
Anyone here still alive?
by
Olazaika1
[June 22, 2024, 06:49:40 am]
very glad to be signing u...
by
Olazaika1
[March 08, 2024, 12:13:38 am]
Awards
2007
Mod of the Year
Editor's Choice
2008
Most Innovative Multiplayer
Nominee
Want to help promote Europe In Ruins? It's as easy as clicking here once a day!
Why?
COH: Europe In Ruins
>
Forum
>
EIR Main Forums
>
Balance & Design
>
[US] Airborne Carbines
Pages: [
1
]
2
3
...
6
Go Down
Print
Author
Topic: [US] Airborne Carbines (Read 24456 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Hicks58
Development
Posts: 5343
[US] Airborne Carbines
«
on:
July 02, 2011, 08:00:01 pm »
Can we do something to make Airborne Carbines actually useful to some degree, or simply flat out replace them with Garands?
Airborne are a 280MP 6 man squad which admittedly if they keep moving can take a reasonable amount of shit. However, their offence against other infantry is right up there with throwing bricks at them angrily.
If it weren't for the fact that they have the 25% less incoming acc as they run for cover, Gren squads would probably maul them for DPS against DPS, and they are a good 40 MP less. In fact, I wouldn't be too surprised if a cover-less fight at medium range resulted in a Gren squad winning.
Airborne are pretty lacklustre for elite infantry against other standard infantry. Yes, there ARE Airborne Riflemen, but to be honest, they aren't particularly needed. It would be better if Airborne were just better rounded infantry. Commandos, Rangers, Stormtroops... All of them can competently put down standard infantry without upgrades using just their rifles. Airborne cannot.
My suggestion would be to give their Carbines Garand stats, or make them have a strong DPS at short range, mediocre DPS at medium range, and pathetic DPS at long range, being Carbines. Using the latter approach might be more appropriate considering Airborne have the 25% less incoming accuracy on the move, and would be able to take advantage of relatively decent close range DPS. (NOT to SMG levels by the way, just competently beating rifles at close range)
Logged
Quote from: brn4meplz on November 05, 2012, 10:45:05 am
I mean I know Obama was the first one in EiR to get a card. and tbfh the Race card is pretty OP. but Romney has the K.K.K., those guys seem to camo anywhere. So OP units from both sides.
Quote from: Mysthalin on March 27, 2014, 04:57:09 pm
At the end of the day, however, stormtroopers finally got the anal invasion with a cactus they have richly deserved for years.
LeoPhone
Honoured Member
Posts: 0
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #1 on:
July 02, 2011, 08:03:36 pm »
AB are supposed to have weak AI. It is the only thing that still keeps them kinda balanced.
fallschirmjagers get AI, airborne gets AT.
Logged
8thRifleRegiment
EIR Veteran
Posts: 2210
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #2 on:
July 02, 2011, 08:05:54 pm »
Quote from: LeoPhone on July 02, 2011, 08:03:36 pm
AB are supposed to have weak AI. It is the only thing that still keeps them kinda balanced.
fallschirmjagers get AI, airborne gets AT.
+1 to Logic
Logged
I will never forget the rage we enduced together
Quote from: brn4meplz on March 08, 2013, 12:46:54 pm
Ohh Good, AmPm can pay in Doubloons.
Poppi
EIR Veteran
Posts: 1080
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #3 on:
July 02, 2011, 08:15:46 pm »
Quote from: LeoPhone on July 02, 2011, 08:03:36 pm
AB are supposed to have weak AI. It is the only thing that still keeps them kinda balanced.
fallschirmjagers get AI, airborne gets AT.
ya i get that feeling forever, since its been like that since vCoH.
to give them bar or smgs or grease guns to a unit that has descent AT abilities, good health, and fire up ability, and airdrop could be the only unit really needed.
The lmg they get is crappy but does a better job than their standard shitty rifles, and works great behind cover.
Plus AB riflemen fill in that position.
Only flaw w/o AB rifleman is if you drop AB units somewhere behind enemy lines, they could have no chance to defend themselves. And get owned in an embarrassing manner.
They do get pretty bad ass airdrop HMG and Mortar teams, which make the inf doc look like shit.
This is one doc i want to see completed really bad. Mostly b/c i hope it doesnt just turn into a more supped up version of an inf company. Hopefully AB doc throws in a few off the wall buffs. Or maybe inf doc needs a remake?
«
Last Edit: July 02, 2011, 08:19:22 pm by Poppi
»
Logged
Tymathee
Donator
Posts: 9741
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #4 on:
July 02, 2011, 08:22:36 pm »
Quote from: LeoPhone on July 02, 2011, 08:03:36 pm
AB are supposed to have weak AI. It is the only thing that still keeps them kinda balanced.
fallschirmjagers get AI, airborne gets AT.
but you gave Falls the ability to buy at rifles and they get fausts oh and there's also falls tank busters.
Pz grens were given a free g43 because alot of people felt their ai was weak and even on top of that the g43 was buffed.
Can we at least get Garands for AB? I know u say "they're supposed to be AT" but their AI is pretty much non existent unless u toss nades if u upgrade with RR's while falls, which btw are also cheaper mp wise, get fausts if they get a gun upgrade, which also they get a choice of several (g43's, rifle nades and fg42)
so the FJ while being a cheaper platform gets better armor, more options and if u take a vanilla fj, which has 4 men vs a vanilla AB, which has 6 men lmao that AB will not only lose, it'll get raped.
Logged
Quote from: nikomas on October 04, 2012, 09:26:33 pm
"I want proof!"
"I have proof!"
"Whatever, I'm still right"
Dafuq man, don't ask for proof if you'll refuse it if it's not in your favor, logic fallacy for the bloody win.
Tachibana
NotADev
Posts: 1270
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #5 on:
July 02, 2011, 09:04:01 pm »
I'm fine where Airborne stand. Though, I wouldn't mind seeing them drop from 9 pool to 8.
What I really want is to be able to get the Airborne LMG on Airborne riflemen.
Logged
Quote from: TheWindCriesMary on April 17, 2013, 02:21:45 pm
It's like saying "i can understand his concerns that fire breathing dragons live in far away lands"
Quote from: Shabtajus on February 22, 2016, 12:06:00 am
americans dont dodge wars.
Quote from: Trapfabricator
Literally, The only thing less likely than this is zombie hitler becoming prime minister of israel
RikiRude
Donator
Posts: 4376
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #6 on:
July 02, 2011, 09:07:25 pm »
leo there is no real logic with your statement. storms, rangers, falls, commandos, ALL do at/ai and they ALL do it well!
bring back AB riflemen, what was the problem with them before? make them like 310ish mp. AB armor, option for bars and nades, and fireup, no stickies.
take away the lmg, give it to some other doctrine, it just doesnt fit AB, or give it to the rifles. they need a weapon they can fire on the move.
or give regular ab the option for garands or something.
Logged
Quote from: Killer344
Killer344: "Repent: sory no joke i just had savage diorea"
Quote from: Malgoroth on October 10, 2011, 05:03:49 pm
... or a fat ass cock sucking churchill being stupid
Tymathee
Donator
Posts: 9741
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #7 on:
July 02, 2011, 09:12:10 pm »
there are AB riflemen. they just have infantry armor, normal priced bars (not 95 as before) and no fireup.
and yeah. lmg is kinda retarded for ab since they're at their best on the move, not standing still.
Logged
Poppi
EIR Veteran
Posts: 1080
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #8 on:
July 02, 2011, 09:37:45 pm »
Quote from: Tymathee on July 02, 2011, 09:12:10 pm
and yeah. lmg is kinda retarded for ab since they're at their best on the move, not standing still.
really? i thought i did great with them while in a house.
I guess i was thinking in cover staying still LMG will rock since they can use bi pods.
But makes sense. Since in EIRR the smg Greasegun for some reason has the worst accuracy on the move even when compared to the other guns , whywouldnt LMGs be better on the move? Love this ass backwards logic to guns.
Logged
RikiRude
Donator
Posts: 4376
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #9 on:
July 02, 2011, 10:08:50 pm »
Quote from: Poppi on July 02, 2011, 09:37:45 pm
really? i thought i did great with them while in a house.
I guess i was thinking in cover staying still LMG will rock since they can use bi pods.
But makes sense. Since in EIRR the smg Greasegun for some reason has the worst accuracy on the move even when compared to the other guns , whywouldnt LMGs be better on the move? Love this ass backwards logic to guns.
uhm... you cant fire them on the move lol, thats the problem.
Logged
Katusha
EIR Veteran
Posts: 989
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #10 on:
July 02, 2011, 10:40:39 pm »
Quote from: Tymathee on July 02, 2011, 09:12:10 pm
whine whine whine
What is this i dont even...........
1) FSJ are 4 men vs AB 6
2) You are complaining about FAUSTS, when AB can get LMGS (not to mention nuclear pineapples.. k!
3) Each unit has the perfect type of armor. You can't say FSJ get better armor, because AB get good armor for their job too, as do FSJ
4) Tank shoots at FSJ...down to 2 guys, lose half DPS, tank shoots at AB 1 guy dies..... trololol we still got 2 RR's and we can lose 3 more guys and keep DPS, u mad?
I'm not even against giving garands to AB, but get out of your allies fanboy boot, and go try out FSJ before comparing.
Logged
Tymathee
Donator
Posts: 9741
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #11 on:
July 02, 2011, 11:14:01 pm »
Kat...
1) Leo said that AB are AT and FJ's are AI. So when you look at them in their finally vcoh package, FJ's with Fg42's and AB with RR's, FJ are great at AI and ok at AT cuz they have fausts while AB are bad at AI and great at AT, but cost more to do both (nades cost more than fausts and RR's more than fg42's and also cost more in MP)
2) Yes, but FJ's can have a great ai weapon and a good personal AT weapon. Nades are real good yes but way easier to dodge than fausts.
3) FJ's get Soldier armor, which protects them while they stand still or move, while AB armor is only good while moving and is normal infantry armor when standing still.
4) what's that got to do with anything?
and who was fanboying? I just stated facts in my post. I play with ALL sides. I have level 9 accounts in pe, ami's, brits and wehr.
The fact is, FJ's get more options than AB and are stronger, yet cheaper.
I'll make my own argument and counter your argument b4 u even say it.
me: FJ's are better because they get g43's, which get instant suppression and 5 second slow. fg42's, and riflenades
you: but AB riflemen get bar's with suppression fire
me: Yes but g43's are 20 mu cheaper, and fj's can still cloak in cover, get fausts, get anti building nades and sprint, which btw doesn't cause exhaustion. fg42's are really good vs any infantry type but elite armor and rifle nades on fj's just seem to be more awesome than riflenades on tommy's
you: ab riflemen get stickies and nuke nades!
me: yes but AB riflemen lose the ability to fire up, lose their AB armor and stickies are 95 mu, 15 mu more than what normal riflemen have.
you: stop your fanboing, ab are awesome and kill my stuff!
me: -_-
«
Last Edit: July 02, 2011, 11:16:00 pm by Tymathee
»
Logged
Rahx
EIR Veteran
Posts: 1147
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #12 on:
July 02, 2011, 11:41:33 pm »
Hmm, I have to admit... it's
fact-alicious
Logged
Quote from: LeoPhone on June 25, 2011, 04:06:43 pm
why is everyone except me retarded?
AmPM
Community Mapper
Posts: 7978
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #13 on:
July 03, 2011, 12:04:00 am »
I think you should make the AB Carbine worthwhile, and remove the stupid LMG.
Logged
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
brn4meplz
Misinformation Officer
Posts: 6952
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #14 on:
July 03, 2011, 12:20:05 am »
I think we should not touch any of their weapons but remove the stupid LMG.
Fun Fact #7 Ab can actually win against volks by always moving!
Aside from that AB should never go toe-to-toe with Axis infantry
Logged
He thinks Tactics is a breath mint
Quote from: Unkn0wn on July 31, 2012, 03:50:15 am
Wow I think that was the nicest thing brn ever posted!
Quote from: Bear on June 19, 2013, 01:24:59 pm
the pussy of a prostitute is not tight enough for destroy a condom
RikiRude
Donator
Posts: 4376
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #15 on:
July 03, 2011, 01:06:02 am »
Quote from: brn4meplz on July 03, 2011, 12:20:05 am
I think we should not touch any of their weapons but remove the stupid LMG.
Fun Fact #7 Ab can actually win against volks by always moving!
Aside from that AB should never go toe-to-toe with Axis infantry
fun fact, infantry that cost 280mp. why ab of all infantry should be so shitty compared to all other elite infantry is beyond me. how about just make it so AB dont have to move to get their bonus? or decrease mp cost and increase rr cost slightly.
sorry, didnt realize the image had been so big!
«
Last Edit: July 03, 2011, 10:46:00 am by RikiRude
»
Logged
brn4meplz
Misinformation Officer
Posts: 6952
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #16 on:
July 03, 2011, 01:15:37 am »
Why don't Commando's perform better against tanks! I mean come on they cost 310 manpower but their PIAT's can never hit a tank thats moving at 35 range. Gawd! comeon!
My Rangers never penetrate anything except Light vehicles. Even then I have to hit the damn unit first. WTH is wrong with my semi reliable zooks.
250Mu on a 4 man squad! WTF is that man. 1 Tank shot. BAM squad nearly dead.
Yeah the AB Squad isn't great against Infantry. The AB Squads best Anti Infantry asset is the hand grenade. (FSJ get shit grenade) However the have the most reliable handheld AT in the game and the best survival modifiers for their job of any Elite Infantry. They are also the highest Hitpoint Elite Infantry. For these reasons they pay what they do.
Logged
Demon767
Warmap Betatester
EIR Veteran
Posts: 6190
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #17 on:
July 03, 2011, 01:29:10 am »
are we seriously gonna buff AB!? Wtf is this, i havent heard such a story in EIR for 2 years!! wait till the doctrine is complete before changing anything jeeze -.-
Logged
Generalleutnant of The Reichs Wolves
Nevergetsputonlistguy767
PonySlaystation
EIR Veteran
Posts: 4136
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #18 on:
July 03, 2011, 02:03:32 am »
Quote from: brn4meplz on July 03, 2011, 01:15:37 am
Why don't Commando's perform better against tanks! I mean come on they cost 310 manpower but their PIAT's can never hit a tank thats moving at 35 range. Gawd! comeon!
My Rangers never penetrate anything except Light vehicles. Even then I have to hit the damn unit first. WTH is wrong with my semi reliable zooks.
250Mu on a 4 man squad! WTF is that man. 1 Tank shot. BAM squad nearly dead.
Yeah the AB Squad isn't great against Infantry. The AB Squads best Anti Infantry asset is the hand grenade. (FSJ get shit grenade) However the have the most reliable handheld AT in the game and the best survival modifiers for their job of any Elite Infantry. They are also the highest Hitpoint Elite Infantry. For these reasons they pay what they do.
Not really. Commando Piats and Ranger Zooks are both great handheld AT. Airborne have no AI infantry. Their pool value is so high that it's not worth it to have unupgraded airborne or upgraded with lmgs and airborne riflemen are worse than regular riflemen (again because of pool value and other issues). Grenades are not really great on RR squads since they're not supposed to be battling infantry anyways.
So you can say that they don't need AI infantry/weapons, that may be true. But you cannot say that what they've got can perform that role well. Carbines are worse than Garands and that is just wrong.
«
Last Edit: July 03, 2011, 05:13:53 am by PonySlaystation
»
Logged
Sharks are not monsters Henley, they are cute, cuddly and misunderstood. They love humans. sometimes they love TOO much. They love people so much that sometimes their kisses separate people into two flailing pieces which are consumed by other sharks in a frenzy of peace and joy.
Mysthalin
Tired King of Stats
Posts: 9028
Re: [US] Airborne Carbines
«
Reply #19 on:
July 03, 2011, 05:07:17 am »
Brn, you are being ridiculous. You can't possibly justify a 280 MP airborne squad losing to bloody volks which cost 190 MP.
What you are saying about airborne winning vs volks if they always move is a
lie
.
The moving accuracy of the carbine almost entirely counteracts the accuracy decrease volk K98s get when shooting at airborne. Considering the fact you're not going to be able to shoot all of the time while moving (there will come a time where you'll move sideways or backwards), and that the volks can simply take cover(much higher boost) you'll simply get raped with the airborne.
Quote
They are also the highest Hitpoint Elite Infantry
At 70 HP/man they are outdone by grenadiers (80 HP/man), KCH (90 HP/man) and Storms (95 Hp/man). Squad Hp is fucking irrelevant because it will not in any way shape or form save you from splash damage (being 6-man only makes it worse), nor does damage "spill-over" when a squad member is at low health and is hit by something that deals a ton of damage.
Your comparison of AT assets is childish and yet again, completely irrelevant to the discussion. What you are comparing are UPGRADES, not the units themselves. If you pay more for an AT asset in the sense of munitions - you SHOULD get more out of the AT asset at the job it's meant to do. As far as I'm aware - the RR is more expensive than the PIAT, and RIDICULOUSLY more expensive than the bazooka. You would expect the RR to be a lot better than either the PIAT, or the Bazooka - and the platform has nothing to do with it.
And finally,
F U C K
AB riflemen and their BAR. The reason why AB became retarded last time it had a doctrine was because everything about it was long-range. The RR - long range, the BAR - long range, yet becoming only better if you engage it at shorter ranges. Everything screamed "Yeah, we rape you at long range but if you come closer it's only getting worse". So I propose to
F U C K
the BAR. Replace it with the M2 carbine upgrade, which I've already proposed in another thread. Oh, and firesparks :
F U C K
the lack of "effects" in making the weapon. Just replace the sound of the carbine with the thompson, or borrow some sort of automatic weapon sound from another mod. There's tons of them.
Logged
Pages: [
1
]
2
3
...
6
Go Up
Print
Jump to:
Please select a destination:
-----------------------------
News & Introductions
-----------------------------
=> Updates & Announcements
=> EIR Boot Camp
===> In Other Languages
=====> In Chinese
=====> In German
=====> In Spanish
=====> In Polish
=====> In French
=====> In Norwegian
=> New Players
-----------------------------
EIR Main Forums
-----------------------------
=> General Discussion
=> Tactics & Strategy
=> Balance & Design
=> Broadcasts & Replays
=> Projects & Mapping
=> Technical Support
===> Bug Reporting
-----------------------------
General Forums
-----------------------------
=> General Discussion
=> Other Games
TinyPortal v1.0 beta 4 ©
Bloc
Loading...