Unleaked: Super Pershing

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[Groundfire]

why not balance the current units. why not balance the current doctrines. yea the priorities of some devs are kinda weird tbh. Whatever, in 2013 we got company of heroes 2 and then we can decide weather we play this super nice idea of EiRR with these nice developers (if they will get this product finished in 2013  ) or maybe a super nice new coh.

This game will never be balanced because every single person in the community has a different perception of what balance is. Even if we did fix design flaws like giving doctrine free buffs costs, there will never be a consensus until you make CoH a mirrored game like chess, or even starcraft.

You cannot have balance with asymmetrical unit design, veterancy and tech structure. It quite literally is impossible. I am sick of you turds saying that we are neglecting this aspect of development because it quite literally is not true at all.

You need to realize the game your playing.

[Hicks58]

I normally start twitching when I see inaccurate statistics posted, but for this one I'm just gonna let it fly considering this unit will never see the light of day. >.<

[Smokaz]

why is this such a big deal anyways, who cares

[Nug]

Probably a reward unit.

every single person in the community has a different perception of what balance is

Isn't balance a fact and not a perception or opinion?


1st problem)

EIR is about out attritioning your enemy so If something is clearly better for the cost ratio that it delivers it's too good,  if it performs under cost ratio, it's too bad and needs to be better.


2nd problem of different nature)

There are upgrades in eir that when used in numbers 1-2 are too bad, but when are spammed on whole company they are OP. (faust alpha strike). - a way of fixing this would be to up the price and the damage done to a higher number so 1 faust deals more damage so it is usefull in small numbers as a support weapon and not main AT, thus it would not allow to field high number of said weapon because munitions costs would not allow this but at the same time it would be usefull to effectively cripple a tank - same with other upgrades, units etc.

[Spartan_Marine88]

Isn't balance a fact and not a perception or opinion?

While balance is a fact people still complain no matter what due to perceived imbalances within the game.

Example.

Your about to do the sweetest flank that will wipe out 4 atgs with a single assault gren squad. 1 m8 comes along and ends it due to lack of support and better micro, person goes to forums and complains how OP m8 is and how terrible assault grens are and gets a few other people to back him. Suddenly things seem imbalanced, when they really are balanced.

[Ahnungsloser]

While balance is a fact people still complain no matter what due to perceived imbalances within the game.

Example.

Your about to do the sweetest flank that will wipe out 4 atgs with a single assault gren squad. 1 m8 comes along and ends it due to lack of support and better micro, person goes to forums and complains how OP m8 is and how terrible assault grens are and gets a few other people to back him. Suddenly things seem imbalanced, when they really are balanced.

Your discription fits to ~50% of all "balance issues".

[aeroblade56]

i think imbalanced is when you have 4 atgs shoot at a 88 and its shoots them dead.

[tank130]

There are upgrades in eir that when used in numbers 1-2 are too bad, but when are spammed on whole company they are OP. (faust alpha strike). - a way of fixing this would be to up the price and the damage done to a higher number so 1 faust deals more damage so it is usefull in small numbers as a support weapon and not main AT, thus it would not allow to field high number of said weapon because munitions costs would not allow this but at the same time it would be usefull to effectively cripple a tank - same with other upgrades, units etc.

ROFLMAO!!!!!

That is exactly what the weapons cache was - good luck promoting that one Nug.

[AmPM]

ROFLMAO!!!!!

That is exactly what the weapons cache was - good luck promoting that one Nug.

Actually, what Weapons Cache did was artificially limit your ability to spend Munitions. This plan is to increase the individual power of the upgrades and increase their price. With the increase in price you would see a drop in amount.

Just because something is damaging in high numbers does not make it OP. Fausts for instance, use and HMG or 2 or 3. Still costs less than those 4 Volks and will nail them to the floor.

[Nug]

Actually, what Weapons Cache did was artificially limit your ability to spend Munitions. This plan is to increase the individual power of the upgrades and increase their price. With the increase in price you would see a drop in amount.

Just because something is damaging in high numbers does not make it OP. Fausts for instance, use and HMG or 2 or 3. Still costs less than those 4 Volks and will nail them to the floor.

Yes but the actual price and the damage would have to be high.   4 fausts make 300 dmg and cost 160mu at one strike. I think that giving  300 dmg to 1 faust on 1 use and 250mu price would be ok.

This way you wouldn't be able to spam because simply 5 fausts would eat 1000mu, but 1 faust would actualy support your main AT effectively.It would be a situational weapon vs enemy tank. If someone would want to create a 4 volk faust callin, he would be able to do it, but only 1 time.

Same with other upgrades and units analogicaly that are weak alone but strong in numbers.

I believe that this solution would finaly put an end to spam by having viable usefull units and upgrades.

[tank130]

Actually, what Weapons Cache did was artificially limit your ability to spend Munitions.

sigh........ Such a simple process confuses such simple minds.....lol

If we completely ignore the fact that the weapons cache was in Beta and had not been balanced - then possible with a massive stretch of the imagination, your claims could be true.

Once the WC was balanced correctly, it would only limit your munitions if you were spamming the shit out of upgrades on something else.

It really is pointless to argue the merits of the cache, as it has been removed and another system is about to be implemented anyway.
Of course, we expect the same group of people to QQ all day long about it, but frankly we don't cater to forum lurkers who don't play anymore.

[Nug]

as it has been removed and another system is about to be implemented anyway.

What is it going to be?

[Mister Schmidt]

AmPm does play tbh

[AmPM]

sigh........ Such a simple process confuses such simple minds.....lol

If we completely ignore the fact that the weapons cache was in Beta and had not been balanced - then possible with a massive stretch of the imagination, your claims could be true.

Once the WC was balanced correctly, it would only limit your munitions if you were spamming the shit out of upgrades on something else.

It really is pointless to argue the merits of the cache, as it has been removed and another system is about to be implemented anyway.
Of course, we expect the same group of people to QQ all day long about it, but frankly we don't cater to forum lurkers who don't play anymore.

If you balanced it properly you wouldn't need WC in the first place. If 50mu I too low and 55 too high try 52 or 53. Or make it 50 or 55 and adjust damage to balance. You already have 4 systems in place, resources, pop, pool and stats. Don't need a 5th.

Also, I play more than you Tank, and we are still stuck listening to you. Right now I'm trying to make AB centric AB work.

[pqumsieh]

It might possibly be a way to properly balance vanilla units against upgraded units.

[AmPM]

Yea, but again, that should be done through cost.

IF someone wants to make a PFaust company, or a grenade company, or LMG or BAR or whatever, that should be allowed within the limits of their company resources. Not because they are only allowed to purchase a few of whatever item it is before the Cache bites them in the ass.

[aeroblade56]

faust already provide excellent at if they did 300 damage wouldnt it like destroy any LV in a single hit?. i think faust currently are pretty darned balanced if you keep them with a p4 you can take on a TD or a sherman. they provide excellent area of denial  and for 3 of them at 40 munitions i would say. thats pretty darn fair.

[Groundfire]

Im going to chime in. There is no way in hell that we would implement a 300 damage faust, regardless of what it costs until it functions under the same rules as other projectiles.

Fausts dont miss. They may not always penetrate, but they sure as fuck dont miss. If you want a 300 damage faust, then its got to be able to miss the tank along with a high cost.

it basically needs to be a one time schreck launch for it to be balanced but that comes at a reduction in damage from the original 300, and I know no one would pay any amount of muni for a single schreck shot.

As stated by aeroblade, limited use AT is supposed to be for area denial, not your main AT. It can only maintain this function for so long if we buff it in any kind of way or redesign the faust into a more balancable weapon.

[AmPM]

Hey now, I've had a faust hit a bush when I was shooting a tank

[chefarzt]

http://forums.europeinruins.com/index.php?topic=10401.0
Rings a bell?